1975 UK/Euro spec twin disc.. master cylinder help

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PaulXR

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Guys.. i'm in the UK and have an XS650B 1975 which was my dads who bought it in 77, i've just put it back together after it sat for 25 years in bits but i'm desperately looking for a rebuild kit for the 13/16 bore master cylinder.

Can anyone help or perhaps point me where i could find something like this.. seems to be hard to get hold of or find any info on that size master cylinder and obviously dont want to have to buy another unit.

Cheers.. Paul

00b8ff3e-7e71-430c-86d5-b8da0bc63dc4_zpsyozzja6k.jpg
 
Thanks guys glad you like the yam, still on original paint from 75 too..!

If i dont have any luck tracking down and buying one here in the UK i'll give mike a call.

I'm amazed that this has become such a nightmare trying to find something so simple... or locate 'any' info about it.. is a 13/16th bore that rare on an XS..??

At the end of the day a seal is a seal and something must be produced 'somewhere'.. just finding it.

Question is... what do you other Euro/UK XS650B twin disc owners do....??

Appreciate any help, advice, pointers etc

Cheers.. Paul
 
PaulXR said:
Thanks guys glad you like the yam, still on original paint from 75 too..!

If i dont have any luck tracking down and buying one here in the UK i'll give mike a call.

I'm amazed that this has become such a nightmare trying to find something so simple... or locate 'any' info about it.. is a 13/16th bore that rare on an XS..??

At the end of the day a seal is a seal and something must be produced 'somewhere'.. just finding it.

Question is... what do you other Euro/UK XS650B twin disc owners do....??

Appreciate any help, advice, pointers etc

Cheers.. Paul
Click to expand...
Hi paul selling on ebay at the moment is a seal kit for a 75/76 model... look up number 180869280681... the master cylinder fitted to that year should have a clear pot for the fluid with a screw top, like the one near the rear wheel.. you may want to strip yours first and check the plunger dimensions with the ones in the add. I bought an xs650b in 1976 and owned it for 30 yrs so the picture of yours has bought back some good memories....
 
Beautiful restore and welcome.

13/16ths seems to be large even for twin disc set up, that equates to 20.6 mm

I see the bike has a lot of the 76C style parts, exhausts and forks, with the calipers mounted behind the forks and twin disks.

I have heard the 75 had a change midway through 75 to incorporate these changes, it was a European thing only.

I am confirming Vin no's for the different models, worldwide, to help with the accuracy of the ID chart i have posted in the Garage ID thread.

If you don't mind could you help me out with the prefix and the first 3 no's, (some members don't like to post the whole vin), . Normally I'd PM members but you don't have it set up for that contact.

Thanks 650Skull
 
650Skull said:
Beautiful restore and welcome.

13/16ths seems to be large even for twin disc set up, that equates to 20.6 mm

I see the bike has a lot of the 76C style parts, exhausts and forks, with the calipers mounted behind the forks and twin disks.

I have heard the 75 had a change midway through 75 to incorporate these changes, it was a European thing only.

I am confirming Vin no's for the different models, worldwide, to help with the accuracy of the ID chart i have posted in the Garage ID thread.

If you don't mind could you help me out with the prefix and the first 3 no's, (some members don't like to post the whole vin), . Normally I'd PM members but you don't have it set up for that contact.

Thanks 650Skull
Click to expand...

that makes it even cooler.:thumbsup:
 
Paul, hi, I'm a Brit ex pat in Vancouver Isle trying to subvert the population with UK style cafe racers... My cafe racer is a 77 which has the same brake components as RD250/400 XS everything from 250-1100, but are the generation of components after the ones that you have. I have grafted a second disc and calliper onto the front of my bike and used a master cyl from an XS1100. Apparently they are all pretty much the same, 750/850/1100

The master cyl I bought off eBay from usa turned out to be full of the desert sands of the mojave despite looking presentable on the outside. It was a piece of the proverbial to buy a cyl rebuild kit off a bloke in usa for just a few quid and a relaxing morning working out how to dismantle it with the minimum destruction and thence clean wash and rebuild.

Buy a rebuild kit, from overseas if necessary and rebuild it. The xs1100 one is 11/16 and the single disc later one is 14mm

If push comes to shove you might be able to get away with stripping cleaning and reassembling...?
Jonathan
 
charlieyam thanks for your reply, unfortunately the kit on ebay from RAW wont fit. I contacted them as the said 75, but its too small.

Cheers.. Paul
 
650Skull thanks for your reply, no problem with Vin, it's 447-502***. Yes the silencers are different, they used to be the cigar shaped ones. Dad ordered replacements in the early 80's but when they turned up they were now using this type, so he was stuck with them.. but never got round to fitting them. They fit ok but the link pipe fouls the main stand slightly, but these days i'm lucky to have unfitted original NOS silencers from the 80's.

Forks, calipers, master cylinder, lower 1 into 2 brake line splitter are factory fitted items for the time, the bike was only 2 years old when dad bought it and was as new from a showroom with only a couple of hundred miles on. I also had 2 XS650B's in the late 70's and they were exactly the same set-up as this one. The B model in EU/UK came with twin calipers behind the legs, slightly more rigid frame with a few extra strengthening gussets and possibly a steering head angle change after Percy tait helped Yamaha to develop what later became this XS650B.

The petrol tank i believe for UK models had no stripe going over onto the top of the tank, also the side panels had twin white/gold strips top & bottom, aluminium speedo/rev counter mount/surround, small oval type tail-light.. and a few other changes.

Here's a couple of pics of the master cyl.. Cheers. Paul

Img_5622_zps5whsunai.jpg

Img_5624_zpsy6gmpric.jpg

Img_5623_zpsk11yvnez.jpg
 
Hi Jonathan, funny you should mention the other XS range.. last night i found on Wemoto parts website the spec for an XS750 rebuild kit and the bore was 17.3mm (roughly 11/16) so maybe i can get away with that master cyl or the 1100 if i cant find a rebuild kit for this one. Cheers.. Paul
 
I was a little confused about the bike being a B, the twin disk rotors, the mufflers, (explained), and the caliper mounts on the rear of the forks all pointed the bike to being a 76C but the gauges and tank are still a 75B.

Looking at the forks again i see they have been swapped over so the calipers mount on the rear of them. 2 things tell me this.
1; the lugs for the brake hoses are on the front of the forks.
2; the axle clamp is on the right side of the front wheel, all XS650 axle clamps were on the left front.

The engine would have the 533 con-rods, is that correct?

Normally the 75B didn't have twin disk front so i am presuming you father converted the bike to twin disk. If he did then the M/C would not be original, maybe that's why it is an odd size................ Re reading your post, the previous owner could have done the twin rotor conversion and the front fork swap

Both the TX750 and TX 500 had twin rotor front disk brakes, could the M/C be from either of those
 
Like i said 650Skull, i've had 2 B's and this one of my dads is the 3rd, they all had twin discs as standard and most definately not a conversion.. thats how it came in the UK. Brake hose clamps on this model were on the front and rear of the slider, and the bottom yoke carries a factory hose splitter with 1 in and 2 outs for twin disc, and spindle clamps on right lower leg. You can see twin discs fitted to a lot of UK B's if you google, this was factory standard issue.

This is Tony's B http://www.vjmc.com/xs650.html with factory twin disc but aftermarket discs, spindle clamps on right, same forks as mine and others over here such as this one. http://www.usedmotors4sale.co.uk/detail/Used-1975-Yamaha-XS650B/dYePABdeBYYEBPpPpEE.html ..same small oval tail-light also. I think there were a number of subtle changes depending on where & when the bike was released, but one thing i do know 100% because i was there when these things were being sold new over here.. this bike has never been changed, crashed or converted. I am also lucky enough to have the original service booklet supplied from Yamaha in 75, and even the XS650(B) owners manual in 3 languages showing exactly the same model. Also a rather nice brochure i spotted recently with spindle clamps on right as many UK/Euro spec were back then.

xsbrochure_zpsybjcknnp.jpg
 
have you tried yambits? if the parts are not shown on there website give them a ring,theres not much they cant get hold of!
 
Yes Bucko, funnily enough i contacted Dave straight away to see if they had anything as i've had loads from them over the years for my FZ750 and 350LC, he said as they only used that size bore for such a short time it's hard to say who'd be able to supply a kit these days. He did point me to the twin disc replacement they sell to replace the 13/16 http://yambits.co.uk/xs650-brake-master-cylinder-twin-disc-p-52868.html
Had a word with wemoto, our local yam dealer, facebook xs groups, mikesxs and a few others.. just waiting for heiden to reply now. Amazing innit.. i can get everything for my 1958 A10 but not a rebuild kit for an xs650 lol.
Cheers.. Paul
 
PaulXR said:
Like i said 650Skull, i've had 2 B's and this one of my dads is the 3rd, they all had twin discs as standard and most definately not a conversion.. thats how it came in the UK. Brake hose clamps on this model were on the front and rear of the slider, and the bottom yoke carries a factory hose splitter with 1 in and 2 outs for twin disc, and spindle clamps on right lower leg. You can see twin discs fitted to a lot of UK B's if you google, this was factory standard issue.

This is Tony's B http://www.vjmc.com/xs650.html with factory twin disc but aftermarket discs, spindle clamps on right, same forks as mine and others over here such as this one. http://www.usedmotors4sale.co.uk/detail/Used-1975-Yamaha-XS650B/dYePABdeBYYEBPpPpEE.html ..same small oval tail-light also. I think there were a number of subtle changes depending on where & when the bike was released, but one thing i do know 100% because i was there when these things were being sold new over here.. this bike has never been changed, crashed or converted. I am also lucky enough to have the original service booklet supplied from Yamaha in 75, and even the XS650(B) owners manual in 3 languages showing exactly the same model. Also a rather nice brochure i spotted recently with spindle clamps on right as many UK/Euro spec were back then.

xsbrochure_zpsybjcknnp.jpg
Click to expand...
I suspected that the Raw seal kit was too small in spite of them saying it was for a 75/76. The link you attached of Tonys XS650 is a picture of My Old XS.. I bought it in 1976 and sold it in 2005. In that time i did over 100000 miles and apart from a camchain and ring change at about 50000 then the motor was not touched.. Tony and I are still good friends . It is a B model like yours... It came with Twin cable throttle one to each carb. a pig to keep ballanced so I put C model 38mm carbs on , that are linked and changed the throttle to a single cable. The discs are original, I had them drilled in 1978 to improve wet weather braking and reduced unsprung weight. After I sold it tony changed the ft. mudguard, and one or two other things.. There are loads of master cylinders that you could use but as your bike is so factory it would be a shame not to use the original..The B model came as you say with the cigar silencers, and these did not have a balance pipe... I can endorse your reply to skull, the picture in the brotcher is a B model for europe even has the twin throttle cables if you look close... Good luck with your search for parts ,im not far from you in cardiff if your ever in the area ,call in .
 
5twins said:
I decided to give Google a shot. In stead of typing "nissin" I mistakenly typed "nissan". Guess what, a bunch of 13/16" MC stuff came up. Apparently old Datsuns and Nissans used some MCs this size. Maybe the seals will fit? .....

http://www.ebay.com/itm/TOYOTA-CORO...Parts_Accessories&hash=item25825ca99e&vxp=mtr
Click to expand...
You may have a point 5 twins , especially as the seals are for an early toyota and if memory serves me well, toyota cars and yamaha xs650 did share pistons and valves from the toyota 2000gt six cylinder.
 
LOL... thats just what i said Charlie when i asked them if their 75 rebuild kit fits the 75 master cylinder, but they had the same old excuse... thats what it says on the box. I've found that people seem to list items and guess all the years are the same.... and usually followed by "dont know mate" when you ask something very technical like.. "what the diameter".! Hey what a coincidence that you owned the xs that Tony has. I've used that pic so may times recently as a reference when i'm looking for pointers.. only my 2 pairs of glasses that i normally wear for close up stuff didnt spot they were original discs lol. Twin throttle cables here as well, just went thru the fun of hunting those down..!! I know they're not the correct silencers but got them to fit ok..ish, the mounting brackets are different, and the balance pipe just fouls the center stand... but we're getting there.. and back on the road soon. Cheers.. Paul
 

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