are these noises normal? 3 vids

[suxelp]

Hi all, a bit of an emergency. I need to go to the test centre (here in Lithuania) but I started hearing a strange intermittent rattle so checked plugs first and the left side is a bit fouled so went to check timing next. As I was manually turning the crank at the alternator I was playing it back n forth to see where the point of spark was and noticed the click sound in the video that I will follow with. First time posting a vid so hopefully I'll figure it out. Anyway.... Can any say if this is normal or if not what it may be? I'm just wondering if it has something to do with the intermittent rattle... Or something else, cheers all. Tonino... Here is a link as I can't seem to upload:

 

[suxelp]

And here is a short vid of her running

 

[suxelp]

Here is one more video, seams when I tilt her up off the side stand the rattling becomes more pronounced. I have no clue where to begin. My only thought is that something is either loose/broke inside that is causing this or oil flow is somehow not right and changes when tilted? Thanks for reading guys, Tonino

 

[peanut]

I would say maybe your cam chain tension or your guides .....possibly the clutch basket rubbing. ..... sounds good otherwise.
Suppose it would be worth checking your rotor and stator can't think of anything else . have you tried to pinpoint the noise by using a wooden dowel or long screwdriver held to your ear ?

 

[suxelp]

I would say maybe your cam chain tension or your guides .....possibly the clutch basket rubbing. ..... sounds good otherwise.
Suppose it would be worth checking your rotor and stator can't think of anything else . have you tried to pinpoint the noise by using a wooden dowel or long screwdriver held to your ear ?

Thanks first off... I did adjust the tensioner and it did not seem to make a difference, I am not sure how to use a screwdriver to check for noise but it seems more pronounced on the left side. Would I be right in saying that we could rule out a clutch basket as that is on the right side? I'm just at a loss and am hoping someone has come across this specific problem and can advise, otherwise all I can think to do is a tear down :-\ oh, and the rotor seems fine to me meaning it does not seem to be wobbling, if that's what you meant. Thanks again!

 

[peanut]

I am not sure how to use a screwdriver to check for noise but it seems more pronounced on the left side. !

ah Ha !...its an old guys technique back in the days before compression testers and dynos and the like.

You'd go to your local backstreet indie and he'd come out wiping his oily hands on an equally oily rag .....prod a few things under the bonnet ,rev the engine , stick a screwdriver on the block and suck in his cheeks hard and pronounce........... 'ooo arr ...big ends mate ...that'll cost ya'

You put the screwdriver handle on your cheekbone just in front of your ear and place the bladed end at various points around the engine until you pinpoint where the noise is coming from.
Nowadays you can buy an Auto Stetoscope for a few dollars and do it the easy way.

 

[TwoManyXS1Bs]

Sounds to me like the PMA rotor is rubbing on something, perhaps a loose screw in the stator mount.
The crankshaft rides on 3 roller bearings, and a single ball bearing. The ball bearing confines lateral movement of the crank. If that bearing is worn enough, tilting the bike left/right can allow the crank to wander/drift left and right. If so, the rotor also moves with it, possibly contacting something behind it.

So, my first recommendation is to pull the rotor and closely inspect, looking for signs of rubbing and scraping. Also, check the condition of the stator and its mount screws.

You can also check the crank for lateral looseness. Put the rotor nut on the end of the crank's tapered shaft, grip it firmly, and shove in/out on that shaft. Ideally, should be no noticable in/out play. Otherwise, consider replacing the crank's primary-drive-side ball bearing...

 

[suxelp]

Sounds to me like the PMA rotor is rubbing on something, perhaps a loose screw in the stator mount.
The crankshaft rides on 3 roller bearings, and a single ball bearing. The ball bearing confines lateral movement of the crank. If that bearing is worn enough, tilting the bike left/right can allow the crank to wander/drift left and right. If so, the rotor also moves with it, possibly contacting something behind it.

So, my first recommendation is to pull the rotor and closely inspect, looking for signs of rubbing and scraping. Also, check the condition of the stator and its mount screws.

You can also check the crank for lateral looseness. Put the rotor nut on the end of the crank's tapered shaft, grip it firmly, and shove in/out on that shaft. Ideally, should be no noticable in/out play. Otherwise, consider replacing the crank's primary-drive-side ball bearing...

Sounds to me like the PMA rotor is rubbing on something, perhaps a loose screw in the stator mount.
The crankshaft rides on 3 roller bearings, and a single ball bearing. The ball bearing confines lateral movement of the crank. If that bearing is worn enough, tilting the bike left/right can allow the crank to wander/drift left and right. If so, the rotor also moves with it, possibly contacting something behind it.

So, my first recommendation is to pull the rotor and closely inspect, looking for signs of rubbing and scraping. Also, check the condition of the stator and its mount screws.

You can also check the crank for lateral looseness. Put the rotor nut on the end of the crank's tapered shaft, grip it firmly, and shove in/out on that shaft. Ideally, should be no noticable in/out play. Otherwise, consider replacing the crank's primary-drive-side ball bearing...

Hi, hey, thanks for that advice, it gives me a bit of hope and it makes a bit more sense when I divulge that I took a VFR 400 stator and rotor and diy adapted it to the girl. So with that there definitely could be something goin on behind the rotor as I had a machine shop turn me a bracket for the stator and hopefully there is something amiss with its mounting. I'll post pictures when I get back in the garage, got roped into goin out to the country tonight to help with some family biz, half of me wants to sneak out in the night and drive back to check it out! Just as well though, was planning on riding to Helsinki today till this issue reared its head so no MOT test and no ride, and no crazy night out in a new city, was suppose to check out Talin the next day, oh well.... Cheers for that again and the glimmer of hope has made my evening

 

[TwoManyXS1Bs]

...got roped into goin out to the country tonight...

???

News Flash: Displaced Brit loses identity. Becomes countryfied.

Y'all take care now, y'hear?

 

[suxelp]

???

News Flash: Displaced Brit loses identity. Becomes countryfied.

Y'all take care now, y'hear?

Well, actually... The short of it is that I'm German born, with an American accent from growing up there that also lived in England for 7 years recently but presently resides in Lithuania and I do get a bit of a southern twang comin out at times

Mornin from our Lithuanian garden.

 

[Michaelo]

ah Ha !...its an old guys technique back in the days before compression testers and dynos and the like.

What's this old guys crap, i still use the thumb attached to the ear, knuckle into the ear, put screwdriver on the bit closest to the noise and presto, you can hear the spinning around bits clearly.....its just the interpretation of the noises as to whats the key........

 

[peanut]

it makes a bit more sense when I divulge that I took a VFR 400 stator and rotor and diy adapted it to the girl. So with that there definitely could be something goin on behind the rotor as I had a machine shop turn me a bracket for the stator and hopefully there is something amiss with its mounting.g

Just goes to show how difficult it can be to diagnose a problem over the net , when you're not told that the bike has been modified
Hopefully 2M has identified the culpret and its an easy fix

 

[suxelp]

Yes, you are right. I'm newish to asking so did not think to elaborate... Anyway, she's an 83 with a 277 rephase using an NWZ-1 ignition system and I have paired that with the VFR 400 PMA having had drawn up a bracket and tapered crankshaft end adapter. Looking back I was always really worried about the rotor not staying stable and probably should of thought more about the stator and used some lock tight on the fixing of it and the bracket.... Hopefully we get out of here early enough so I can stop in.

On another note I ordered new tires from the local Yamaha shop and found when trying to fit them that they have a wider end tread flare so I'm not getting them to fit right. That brought me to another issue which is when I line up the rear axle guides to the same place the tire is well on the chain guard, then I just adjusted to where the tire was centre in the swing arm but that throws the alignment marks way off. So it's either that the tire is suppose to be offset, I put it back wrong.. I don't think it's spoked wrong.

 

[peanut]

blimey that sounds like a problem with the tyres.
I didn't trust the crude marks on the swingarm myself so I used a straight edge to align the rear wheel with the front wheel. I stuck a couple of nails in each end of a straight piece of 3"x2" so that they sat on each side of the rims ...gets it spot on.
Is there any chance your drive sprocket has been changed for a larger one ? that can give chain and tyre clearance issues.

I too have been looking for a new rear tyre lately and everything I've read says that the largest profile that will fit is a 130/90/16 and even that is tight.
Maybe your chain is a link too short ? a picture of your dropouts would confirm. Adding a link or two could give you more clearance perhaps.

One more thing to check... have you made sure that your tyre beads are fully sat into the rim beads ?

 

[suxelp]

Well made it to the garage today but lo and behold... I'm a jackass... Never crossed my mind that I need a new rotor puller now, 20mm 1.5, as the original one definitely is not the same. Contemplating using one of those claw ones as the are really accessible on the shelf but am not sure it would not damage it! Anyone use those?

Regarding the sound again, I listened to the third vid again and it really sounds to me like a chain running over something, maybe the guide partially broke and when I tip her to the side it falls against the timing chain?

 

[suxelp]

Sounds to me like the PMA rotor is rubbing on something, perhaps a loose screw in the stator mount...

Well, that's exactly what it was I've got that sorted now, cheers. Need to post one more question to this great group now.

 

[TwoManyXS1Bs]

Great, suxelp. Glad you got it.

Just a late-to-the-party tip concerning mechanics stethoscope tricks.

Long ago, I learned of using the "mastoid process", the bulbous protrusion just behind the ear. It has a good sonic connection to the auditory system, and can give you better stethoscope sounds. Simply press the screwdriver handle, or steel rod, against this "mastoid process", and see if the sounds are louder and clearer...