Clutch disengagement Issue

[m1ster2]

Hey everyone!
I know I’m a total noob to this forum in posting but I’ve been constantly searching through and found a lot of good help and advice here! But here come my issue...

So I have a 79 that I picked up as a project a little while ago and have been getting it back to running order. So now is the time I need some advice.
I can’t seem to get the clutch to disengage properly... I have a new lever and cable, I adjusted the set screw in to the point where the lock nut might as well not even be on it anymore and still nothing. At a point when I pull the clutch it makes a rather unpleasant chatter, which I’m suspecting is the basket contacting the RH cover. It gets to the point where the kickstart disengages but the clutch will not. If I put it in gear and pull the clutch and try to spin the wheel it does so with very very significant resistance but it does move...

So far I’m suspecting a couple things, either 1. The disks have rusted together, I’m not sure how long the bike sat for, but to my knowledge it always had oil in the case. 2. Somebody tried to service the clutch and put too many disks in. 3. One of the various washers or bearings weren’t installed improperly. 4. The pushrods are out of spec.

If anyone has any advice or something that might be a simpler fix than just replacing everything, Or even just a better idea of what the problem might be, is love to know!

Thanks in advance!

 

[gggGary]

Start by confirming that the ball bearings are in place. I'd bet the one in the worm gear is missing. IIRC the 79 has the 2 piece push rod, there should be a bearing between the two sections A standard hardware store 5/16" bearing works for both those.

#24 in the diagram, it doesn't show the one in the worm because it's supposed to be staked in place, but seldom is.

 

[m1ster2]

Thanks, I'll check it out in the morning!

 

[TwoManyXS1Bs]

Sounds like the typical stuck clutch, from setting so long.
Do a forum search on "stuck clutch"...

 

[gggGary]

Has the motor run? A stack of wet (with oil) clutch plates has a lot of drag, if the motor isn't running you won't have a completely "free" clutch disengagement. If the kickstarter doesn't turn the motor over with the clutch pulled, you are good for now.
http://www.xs650.com/threads/clutch-push-rod-seal-and-worm-gear-install-w-pics.26414/#post-262341

 

[m1ster2]

Thanks for the replys! And for pointing me in some good directions.

Yes the motor runs, tho I am not certain how long it sat before I got it going again. I tried letting everything warm up to see if that made a difference. I had it up on a stand and tried to see if I could unstick the clutch by putting it in gear, pulling the clutch and gently but firmly moving the rear wheel back and forth. Even after that I had it running, put it in gear (up on the stand) and with the clutch in, tried to see if I could at least slow the wheel, no dice. I’m gunna try it with the kickstart next, maybe a couple other things, and if that doesn’t work, I’m just gunna pull everything apart and replace it... buy once, cry once.

 

[5twins]

You may not need new parts, just a disassembly and cleaning of everything, and verifying proper assembly. I just fired one up that sat for a good 12 years. Clutch was stuck a little but kicking it over with the clutch lever pulled in about half a dozen times freed it up. Eventually I will get under that right cover and inspect all the clutch parts, but it's working fine for now.

 

[Paul Sutton]

Mine was stuck. I started it on the center stand and popped it in 1st, pulled in clutch and applied the back brake. It freed up after a few seconds. Later inspection showed no damage to the steel or friction plates.

 

[m1ster2]

Update, replaced the missing bearing, unfroze the clutch, readjusted everything, it still drags....but now the issue is if I’m at a stop I can’t shift it back into neutral...so I’m gunna tear everything apart and see if all the washers and bearings are in place, and while I’m at it, replace some stuff

 

[5twins]

Difficulty finding neutral at a stop once warmed up is a pretty common issue on these.

 

[m1ster2]

Problems run deep. So I pulled it apart, and besides the fiber plates being super worn down, the inner basket was installed with a 30mm nut spring washer and a washer. The inner basket is all chewed up and honestly doesn’t even look like it’s from a 650 as it doesn’t have the spot for the locking tabs... annnddd the rest of the washers were installed wrong. but anyways, tell me what you think if the inter basket should be replaced...

 

[5twins]

Not all the 650 clutches used that locking tab washer on the clutch hub nut. It didn't come along until right around your model year, '79 or '80. An '80 would probably definitely have it, a '79 maybe, maybe not depending on production date. That locking tab washer went hand in hand with a redesigned inner hub and clutch plate configuration. The new style had one less friction plate (6 total) than the earlier design (7 friction plates). There was a spring-loaded steel damper plate held in the bottom of the hub by a retaining wire, that's why it had one less friction plate. I can't tell for sure from your pic, but it doesn't seem like yours has that. It could be a 650 clutch hub, just the earlier 7 plate version.

Yes, replacement of that inner hub probably wouldn't be a bad idea. Good news is you could "upgrade" to the later 6 plate hub with the damper plate, it'll swap right in. It engages smoother because of the damper plate, and that also puts less stress on the damper springs on the back of the main hub.

So, count your clutch friction plates (6 or 7?), and examine your inner hub for the presence of that damper plate in the bottom retained by a wire .....

 

[m1ster2]

Thank you for all the good information! I put everything back together, in the right order with out the extra washers in it, New clutch disks, springs, etc... it seems to have made the right difference. In the future I might try and find one of the newer baskets to put in, but for now this is alright. Just need to fine tune all the adjustments and it should be good to go.
Thanks again for all the help and resources you guys have provided. This is such a great community!