Early clutch question

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Hey guys,
I just want to make sure I have this right. To rebuild my XS2 clutch, what I have to do is, when I tear the old clutch apart I take all the o-ring clutch seperaters off and throw them away, then buy one more steel plate and replace all the friction plates with a later set that has seven friction plates.
Is that all correct? Anything else I need to be aware of?
I also intend to take a good look at my worm gear when I’m in there.
Also, I believe the early bikes came with the long one piece clutch push rod ( that I paid extra for on my other bike) is that correct?
Thanks in advance!
Bob
 
You probably have the early short arm worm which will make for a harder lever pull. You may want to swap that out for one of the later longer arm versions, or a 1L9 arm from an XS400.
 
5twins said:
You probably have the early short arm worm which will make for a harder lever pull. You may want to swap that out for one of the later longer arm versions, or a 1L9 arm from an XS400.
Click to expand...

Thanks 5T,
Yes that’s another thing I intend to check out. I really want this clutch to pull as easily as possible.
 
Start watching eBay now for one. Unfortunately, many 650 parts are demanding a premium price today, and that includes the worm assemblies. That's another thing that makes the XS400 worm an attractive alternative. I got one a few months back for $12. They wanted about $15 or best offer. I offered 12, they accepted. These are the people I got it from. Offer them 12 or 14 for this one and I bet they'll take it .....

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1981-Yamah...ash=item3f726cc077:g:ANEAAOSw9GhYZNGF&vxp=mtr

There are several things about this 400 gear that make it a nice alternative, even an upgrade of sorts. The female part of the worm is the same as the 650 one but uses the later black nylon material. I'm guessing this is a better, harder nylon than the white stuff used on the earlier part. The cable arm steps down instead of up like the 650 ones do. If you read through 2M's thread on worms, you'll see this is what he was trying to accomplish with his modded worm. In theory, a stepped down arm should rotate better without binding.

9qMD1pt.jpg


And one of the biggest benefits in my opinion is that even after properly adjusted, the 400 assembly maintains pretty much 100% contact or engagement between the male and female parts of the worm. The 650 units do not. To attach the cable on the 650 one, you have to lift it nearly 1/2". That backs the male worm out of the female worm. They're not screwed together fully anymore.
 
That’s very useful info 5T! You are the master at scouting good deals on eBay. I’m going to take your advice and make them an offer.

On another note I’ve been wondering if it would be advisable to try and save a little money by shopping for a set of steel plates from a later model clutch on eBay also?
 
Shop for a whole clutch assembly. Personally, I prefer the '80 and newer 6 plate version with the dampened bottom plate. I think it engages smoother and puts less stress on the cushion springs on the back of the outer hub. If you're lucky (and patient), you might find a whole assembly for around $30. But maybe not, like I mentioned, parts prices are on the rise. Here's one from that same seller of the worm gear. Offer them $25, maybe they're meet you in the middle somewhere with a counter offer. You never know on eBay. I just scored a TX750 swingarm for $10 (plus 19 shipping). They wanted about 20 or best offer. I offered 10, they took it, lol. $29 for a TX750 swingarm was a good deal in my eyes.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1980-Yamah...ash=item41bb234666:g:hN8AAOSw9GhYaLR8&vxp=mtr
 
Wow ok, I just looked at that. So you’re saying that whole clutch basket assembly is a straight drop in for my bike? No difference in clearances or shape of splines or anything?
 
Yes, the whole assembly will swap right in. At the very least, besides plates, I think you would want a later inner basket and pressure plate. The early pressure plates like yours only connected to the inner hub with the 6 spring screws .....

ru5hHEV.jpg


Later ones had teeth too that meshed into the inner hub. This made for a much stronger assembly .....

1P0oZbV.jpg


If you got a whole clutch unit, that would give you an extra outer hub you could use on either of your 650s. The shock absorbing springs mounted in the back of the outer hub break sometimes. They make a spring replacement kit but it costs near $50, and you can usually get a whole used clutch assembly for that or less. You get lots more parts than just springs then. Some day, I'd like to figure out just what size and strength those damper springs are, and find a cheap source. I've already sourced the button head Allens and thin nuts used to replace the factory rivets that hold the hub together. But all that allows me to do is take apart 2 and make up one good one by combining the parts.
 
Last edited:
Thank you for the detailed explanation.
Daniel Black just contacted me and said he has some assemblies in a pile of parts he bought a while back. He said he’s going to see what he has!
This is all good stuff here!
 
Well, that sounds good. At the very least, try to get an inner hub, pressure plate, and both kinds of clutch plates (steel and fiber). Your fiber plates are 3.5mm thick. All the later ones are 3mm thick. Your steel plates are 1.6mm thick. All the later ones are 1.4mm thick ..... except that bottom damper steel plate in the '80 and newer assemblies. That bottom steel is a 1.6mm thick plate just like all your steels.
 
That sounds good. Daniel is going to let me know this weekend what he has and I will go from there. Thanks for all your help 5T!
 
Do keep all your old parts of course, but I'm sure you know that. You'll have a nice supply of 1.6mm thick steels for use as '80 and later damper plates, lol. That may come in handy as Yamaha no longer sells that old 1.6mm steel plate, only the later 1.4mm ones.
 
Cool thread!!

I wonder why MamaYama switched from a 1-piece pushrod on the early bikes to a 2-piecer and then back to the 1-piece again....?
 
I don't think they ever switched back. We do the switching back, lol. I'm not sure what the reason for the 2 piece rod was. If you look at other Yamaha models from the era, none used them. All had long one piece rods. However, many of them were the bi-metal type - alloy rod w/ steel tips. I think that's what we really need to combat that excess play in the hand lever that develops when hot.
 
So this morning I went over to Daniel Blacks house to look at his stash of parts.

Let me tell you a little bit about that. Last year Daniel drove over 100 miles to buy a stash of parts that contained the lower half of three engines plus a bunch of other parts.
Now he had plans to build one good engine out of that for a spare.

Today when I went over he had all the clutch plates laid out in order on a table for me to look at, all cleaned up. And I brought my electric impact wrench and clutch basket holding tool to zip off the clutch baskets.

After doing so we realized that only one basket did not have broken springs, and at that moment I told him he did not have to sell it,
I could keep on looking online. He thought for a moment and said, “No it would make me happy to help you get your bike on the road.”

What do you say to that, except Thank You Daniel! Once again I am amazed and humbled by the kindness and generousity of the members of this forum.

Thank you also to 2M and 5Twins for their technical expertise and the knowledge that they so freely share. I would never have known to swap out my clutch assembly for a newer style.

So I got the newer style assembly, the whole shebang, front to back, and a newer style clutch worm screw assembly with the longer arm.

95D37BC1-AE82-4943-948A-8EFD3E1AC5F4.jpeg
 

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