Ignition opinions please!

[WannabeMike96]

Hey everyone! I’m in a rutt.. I want and or need to update my ignition system, whether it be just new points, condenser, and 2 new basic 4.0 ohm coils OR switch over to a high output electronic system

I’m really not looking for anything crazy or expensive, I want the bike to run just like any other healthy XS out there (I don’t beat the balls out of the vehicles I own.. only occasionally)
This is for my stock '78 650se

Option 1: points and condenser kit + 2 new 4.0 ohm coils.


Option 2: just the high output system

Please let me know what you guys think. I know that points always work with the correct regular maintenance and that is no problem for me as i constantly am toying with my projects. Stated many times, this is a bike just to get on and go. No racing or crazy performance, id rather spend that money on gas and food lol. Please feel free to school me and trow in some links or personal experience, i dont know anything about the quality of Mikesxs products so this is my shot in the dark!
Thanks guys and girls!!!!!

 

[WannabeMike96]

The PAMCO clone (option #2) doesn't exactly have the best reputation. Go with an AUTHENTIC PAMCO if you decide to go that route.

Of course, there's nothing wrong with points either.

Is there any other sites you use for parts? I’m leaning more towards points anyway but I want good quality parts, and thanks for the advice! Good to know!

 

[5twins]

Since you're contemplating dropping near $100 on points stuff, my advice would be to put that towards a (real) Pamco instead. If your advance unit is still in good shape, all you need is the basic ignition. You can get that for about $70 from Pete's site at the moment .....

http://www.yamahaxs650.com/

As far as a coil goes, a used Honda MP08 is a reasonably priced and dependable option. It was used on many of their bikes throughout the '90's. You can usually find a nice one on eBay for less than $20.

As far as the dual points go, setting them can be a trying experience. Do it a couple times and you'll see, lol. Basically, you're dealing with two separate little ignition systems, one for each cylinder. Not only do you need to set the points and timing for each but for best running, you want to try and also match those settings cylinder to cylinder.

If you want to stick with the points for a while longer, just replace them. If your original coils are still OK, those new ones won't be needed or be any better. Do replace the plug wires and caps though. As far as the condenser pack goes, check the condition of your current points faces. If they're badly pitted then yes, you'll need to replace the condenser. If they just show normal wear (grainy, sandpaper-like points faces) then your old condenser pack is still OK and could remain so indefinitely. Condensers are electrically matched to the system. If they're in spec, you get that normal points wear. If they're not, you get the points face pitting. New ones don't always match the spec so if you have a good set now, don't change them, ever, unless they go bad, which does happen occasionally. Get a new set to have as spares.

 

[WannabeMike96]

Since you're contemplating dropping near $100 on points stuff, my advice would be to put that towards a (real) Pamco instead. If your advance unit is still in good shape, all you need is the basic ignition. You can get that for about $70 from Pete's site at the moment .....

http://www.yamahaxs650.com/

As far as a coil goes, a used Honda MP08 is a reasonably priced and dependable option. It was used on many of their bikes throughout the '90's. You can usually find a nice one on eBay for less than $20.

As far as the dual points go, setting them can be a trying experience. Do it a couple times and you'll see, lol. Basically, you're dealing with two separate little ignition systems, one for each cylinder. Not only do you need to set the points and timing for each but for best running, you want to try and also match those settings cylinder to cylinder.

If you want to stick with the points for a while longer, just replace them. If your original coils are still OK, those new ones won't be needed or be any better. Do replace the plug wires and caps though. As far as the condenser pack goes, check the condition of your current points faces. If they're badly pitted then yes, you'll need to replace the condenser. If they just show normal wear (grainy, sandpaper-like points faces) then your old condenser pack is still OK and could remain so indefinitely. Condensers are electrically matched to the system. If they're in spec, you get that normal points wear. If they're not, you get the points face pitting. New ones don't always match the spec so if you have a good set now, don't change them, ever, unless they go bad, which does happen occasionally. Get a new set to have as spares.

That’s definitely info that I didn’t know about the condenser and it pairing to the points, really valuable point right there! Mine are actually in good shape (judging by its appearance) but as far as the coils, I need to do a resistance check on them, I get spark on both plugs but the right side seems a bit weak but it could just be me

 

[650Skull]

Post up some different pics of the bike and of some areas of concern. Sometimes a novice, or even someone with some experience, cannot see problems that we on here have seen 100 times, a pic can be the best diagnostic tool because of our experience with problems. PO's often changed out things or did a fix, (that may have been a solution and even suggested on this site 5 or 6 years ago), that now we know isn't the solution but can cause a different issue........

I guess the question here is, what have you done to your bike and why do you need to do alterations.......what is your real wold experience.

Answers are usually best used with the search button to get more information or use the Tech menu.........A lot of the threads that come up usually have links to other threads.........a few of us do link threads to other threads relating to the same issue to help those who help themselves so good tidbits of good information is not lost in separate threads...........I guess i didn't have to state this because it is mentioned in the intro how the Tech menu and search has yielded so much information.........

Tech menu......Electrical.........Pamco Ignition
http://www.xs650.com/threads/pamco-ignition.46859/

We used to have a guy on here who would post up threads asking for information on problems and sometimes just for information.......His real ad-gender was completely different.........he wouldn't take advice on problems and would quote what he was told by others, (not from the site), and basically dissed our content and then complained we told him he was wrong............He was eventually banned but would come back under different names, and it was after the 5th time he was banned and haven't heard from him in over 12 months..........

 

[650Skull]

That’s definitely info that I didn’t know about the condenser and it pairing to the points, really valuable point right there! Mine are actually in good shape (judging by its appearance)

Unfortunately condition has no relation to their work-ability...

 

[WannabeMike96]

Post up some different pics of the bike and of some areas of concern. Sometimes a novice, or even someone with some experience, cannot see problems that we on here have seen 100 times, a pic can be the best diagnostic tool because of our experience with problems. PO's often changed out things or did a fix, (that may have been a solution and even suggested on this site 5 or 6 years ago), that now we know isn't the solution but can cause a different issue........

I guess the question here is, what have you done to your bike and why do you need to do alterations.......what is your real wold experience.

Answers are usually best used with the search button to get more information or use the Tech menu.........A lot of the threads that come up usually have links to other threads.........a few of us do link threads to other threads relating to the same issue to help those who help themselves so good tidbits of good information is not lost in separate threads...........I guess i didn't have to state this because it is mentioned in the intro how the Tech menu and search has yielded so much information.........

Tech menu......Electrical.........Pamco Ignition
http://www.xs650.com/threads/pamco-ignition.46859/

We used to have a guy on here who would post up threads asking for information on problems and sometimes just for information.......His real ad-gender was completely different.........he wouldn't take advice on problems and would quote what he was told by others, (not from the site), and basically dissed our content and then complained we told him he was wrong............He was eventually banned but would come back under different names, and it was after the 5th time he was banned and haven't heard from him in over 12 months..........

Hey 650Skull that’s alot to take in! To be honest I haven’t gotten the bike running yet, we’ll i did get half of it running.. lol the right cylinder wasn’t firing, certainly getting fuel though. The plug is sparking also, to me it doesn’t seem as bright as the left. New plugs and I made sure it was static timed as precise as possible (I adjusted chain tensioner before I timed it too) I haven’t had much time to mess around with it but the right carb had a completely clogged pilot and the slide was a little gummy (only in the right carb, left was a lot cleaner) I’m not at a loss yet I’m just trying to weigh my options and maybe get some upgrades on the way. Whatever pointer you have for me on this forum please let me know I want to be as efficient as possible here, I don’t know any of the tricks and tips yet! Thanks again 650Skull!

 

[5twins]

That clogged pilot was probably the reason for that cylinder not firing. The weak spark could be a couple things. I see from the pics in your other thread that someone installed new NGK plug caps, which is a good thing, but are they making good contact with the wires? If not, that could be the issue. Usually, when you put new caps on old wires, you trim a little wire off the end to get to some fresh stuff. I also like to prep the wire ends like so .....

I strip about 1/8" of insulation off the wire then fan the strands of the wire out in a radial pattern. This insures a good connection when you screw the plug cap on and/or insert the wire into the coil.

The other issue could be your points. You said you checked the timing but did you use a feeler gauge on the points gaps? If you did and that feeler gauge had any oil on it, you may have contaminated the points faces. It doesn't take much and then the points can misfire or not fire at all. When you use a feeler gauge on points, you must thoroughly clean the blade off first before sticking it in them. You can clean the points faces by getting a business card, cutting it into 1/4" wide strips, spraying them with electrical contact cleaner, and dragging them through the points like a feeler gauge.

 

[JAX71224]

I like points OK but the stock coils are marginal even when new. On my '78 it still has points and gets checked and adjusted as needed about every year or so, more often if an issue appears. The only change is a pair of Dyna coils in approximately stock location but a couple of whacks with a big hammer to the tunnel of the fuel tank for clearance.............Oh, also Iridium plugs, which have been in there for years, so long that I almost forgot about them!