WACO SHOOTING

[hooser]

Like most arrest they just don't put there hands up the want to fight and I believe that was the case.. I have been put in a police car a couple of time in the early 70.. it was yes sir no sir.. not run and fight. Let's stand for the good guy not the bad guy. Millions go about there daily lives and never get arrested, some never learn.
Well I thank you for you opinion , I think we have beet this dead horse to death. So I say good night my friend.

 

[jefft]

You sir must be a cop. Example: Nobody gets arrested if they haven't done something wrong. You don't seem to realize that there are more than a few people in this country that have been cleared of any wrong doing since DNA evidence has came about after spending most of their lives behind bars.
jefft

 

[hooser]

No I am not but have known many, yes there is injustice and always will be but you do not condemn all the cops and our system for it.. Most courts that put people in jail is done by jury of our peers. And Yes I am all for DNA testing. But at the time of most it was not available at the time.
But back to the original post what does this have to do with the Waco shooing?

 

[jefft]

What does it have to do with it. I simply said the government is no better. Look cops enforce the laws. Just because an activity is profitable and deemed legal does not mean it is morally right. I don't know how to make it much clearer other than cops enforce dirty laws that the government profits from. The government has their hands in prostitution and drugs too but their involvement is somehow cleaner? Gun running? The government is involved in that too. We had a agent killed here on the border because of that too. Operation fast and furious. So there you have it the government involvement in prostitution, drugs, and gun running. Isn't that what they are always after the 1% biker for? By the way not one government official has served any time to date for fast and furious.
jefft

 

[weekendrider]

hooser,

I spent 15 minutes on a reply for you.
Relaying my experiences with law enforcement.
None of which is related to the reason for this site.
So out of respect for Travis and what/how he wants the site to work I deleted
that diatribe.
But I'll say I'm glad you haven't had a bad experience with law enforcement.
I personally can not say the same.

 

[member3480]

Yeah I am questioning the conduct of the police. I lived this lifestyle for a while and was like I said in two shooting that had nothing to do with me but it happens fast and then over. There are two video's one got out that shows everyone running and ONE!!! guy with a gun. People there that had nothing to do with it are telling different story.
So if they opened fire on them and though that it was a treat SO BE IT but own it. Don't push it under the carpet. I have plenty of buddy's that were and still police and to me its the worst job you could ever have and they will admit to it. You got two types of police .... The guy who wants to HELP and the guy who puts the badge on and he becomes GOD. So we LIVE in a gun country and people get shot every day in the US somewhere. I live my life on THE LINE with or against so my view is going to be much different than others. If you be leave the news and what they are telling you OK. Me I been there lived it rode with and supported 1% club for a part of my life and if it was a beef they know who to kill and get out of there. There were GOOD TIME clubs there too. like I said one knucklehead started it and many died for nothing.

 

[hooser]

Weekender I spent way to much time on this topic also, nothing good will come out of it.
Daddy, I live my life on "THE LINE" not sure what that means and to tired to care so for this topic I am out of here. If you need New xs parts or info I am always available. Gary

 

[jefft]

Hooser I don't know if you have noticed it or not but law enforcement has been under fire in this country lately more than any time I can remember. You got an officer in Tulsa killing people at point blank range because they thought they pulled their taser and instead pulled their firearm. A man in Baltimore dies after getting mauled by 6 officers and getting their spine severed while in police custody, and people being shot for running in the opposite direction away from officers. Now a cop who spent 30 years in law enforcement and decided to become an outlaw biker. The law is very specific as to when I am able to pull my firearm and it damn well better be justified. The requirements of getting into law enforcement are pretty weak. If you can't take a mentally ill man down with a butter knife in his hand without killing him and 6 other officers on scene than you need some more training other than at the shooting range.
jefft

 

[hooser]

I watch the news and see. But in most of those cases, the police tell them what to do and they don't do it..or they run. the one was a 350 pound man that was not cooperating, they put him in a choke hold..what were they suppose to do.. Look at Ferguson,, the guy was out on bail for gun possession attack a cop in the squad car. was told to stop. what would you have done????.. later we find he robed a liquer store. You really want to protect the bad guy? The punks on the street that walk down the middle of the street?who would just as soon kill you as look at you. There are neighbor hoods I can't walk in at night in my town, yet anyone can come to my neighbor hood, even the bad guys....Know how many times I robbed a store? know how many times I was told to put my hand behind my back.. know how many times I my ass kick by cops.. none , why because I learn at a early age what was right or wrong. So go ahead and feel bad for the bad guy. we all have choice, to do good or bad. what's yours.
I saw a report of all the guns they found in the Waco shooting.. how many were legal,a and if they were why did they ditch them in the bathrooms. Again go ahead and stand up for the bad guys.
I am done now on the subject , so reply if you what but I will stand with the good guys.
An finally if the government is so corrupt what are you dining to change it?

 

[jefft]

A cop can be understandably upset because of what someone has done and is running away but that is a situation where you wouldn't have reason to believe your life is in danger. You cant just haul off and shoot him in the back. They need to follow the same rules of engagement that we do when it comes to discharging a deadly weapon. Also when they have a suspect on the ground and obviously not resisting there is no reason for 4 or 5 officers to continue pounding him with batons. Some of these people they already have in handcuffs. That's what a thug does not a responsible police officer. I'm on the side of a police officer when they act responsible. Some of these recent incidents are nothing more than excessive force and abuse of power.
jefft

 

[hooser]

This is my last one on the subject.. you don't know what excessive force is because you were not there. How about the rioting you probably agree with that.. When was the last time you tried to put a 350 man in cuffs, when did you try and put a woman in the squad car that was high..She will kick you ass. give it a try... I did a ride along one time. There are a whole lot of assholes out there. I don't always agree with the way things are done but don't sit back and blame the government, police for the all problem, do without and see what happens. Look at ferguson with the police there. Now take away see...
Poke me with a fork I am done!!!!

 

[jefft]

I know enough about resisting to see a man laying nearly lifeless on the ground and still continue to see 5 cops still pounding him with batons. Its a video and it doesn't matter what crime he has committed he is now in a submissive posture on the ground so the beating can now stop. This type of video is what will be used in court later. You seem to think that because he first didn't cooperate or because he pissed a cop off he now deservers a good ass whooping. The truth is he probably does but they just don't have the right to give it.
jefft

 

[DIRTY DOG]

I have lived the 1% life style too just like a lot of us on here. now I ride with an AMA club . I have spent time in jail ( 7 days ) for the cops busting the wrong house my house was busted for a meth lab that was not there and no drugs in the house they fucked up my house took my kid's lost my job,they droped the charges with a future indictment,so I could not sue for the damages to my house or for false arrest took me 2 months to get my kids and job back so the cops are dicks and play with lives for no reason even when when they fuck up were the one who pay,as for waco rumor has it the cops did all the shooting,they'er just blaming the 1% bikers for it all,I use to trust the cops NOW I DO NOT TRUST ANY OF THEM even my cop freinds are pushed back a little now that was over 10 years ago and I still don't trust them as I once did. DIRTY DOG OUT...

 

[jefft]

I befriended one cop in my lifetime. He bought the house right across the street from me. He was a motorcycle cop. I had learned that he was also involved in something called the navigator program where youth rode with him who thought they might want to make a career in law enforcement. One day another good buddy called who lived on the same block and said "quick turn on the 6 o'clock news." Their he was my cop neighbor. Seems one of the under age girls that was riding with him got some text messages intercepted from him arranging a meeting. Her mom was checking her frequent text messages and caught the inappropriate messages. He was in his 40's. He blew his career and quickly left town. No charges were filed because nothing physical ever happened. Good thing mom was on her toes.
jefft

 

[phil240]

I normally don't respond to political arguments but I am going to bring some light on this one. This went from more of a discussion about the WACO shooting to a police discussion and about police corruption. I will say that there are alsways some bad mixed in with the good and unfortunately everyone gets branded by whatever the current flavor is in the media. I have read the posts and understand everyones opinion.

In my opinion it is the lack of proper parenting that has led to where we are today. A majority of the workforce is the children that are now adults whem it was every child gets a trophy. These children never knew what rejection was and there were always excuses made for acceptance.

So now you have jobs that require a certain level of requiernments and these children whom are now adults couldnt meet the requirenments. Instead of accepting it and looking for another job these individuals brought lawsuits against the cities and basically forced the job to change the requiernments to suit them.

This brings about that you now have individuals who should have never been hired, being hired. These individuals are inadequate for the job and never should have been hired in the first place. Your reading about and hearing the vast influx of all these errors because of this in my opinion.

This goes for all civil service jobs, not just law enforcement. Now the new thing in NY is that the firemen and firewomen that were forced to be hired from lawsuits are running away from their jobs duties. Literally running away from the fires.

Undertrained officers and the need for officer retraining isnt the answer. The answer is going back to the origional standards and if you can't make it, find another job.


As stated earlier this is my opinion only just as others stated theirs. I am also not going to be baited into an ongoing argument. This is just my .02

 

[hooser]

Thanks for another side of things...just not all or nothing...think we will ever get on track?

 

[jefft]

I agree phil240 with most of what you said. I think the reason I was responsible for getting this from a discussion of Waco to a discussion of police corruption was the fact that one of the biker gang members was also a former cop of over 30 years so therefore it is somewhat related. Here was a guy who many might think was raised properly in the day when all the kids didn't get a trophy just by participating in a sport and he got a honorable job on the good guys side.
jefft

 

[650Skull]

Cant judge a good guy and a bad guy just because one wears a uniform and the other doesn't.............. are you really that naive.

Human nature being what it is means we all deceive others, and ourselves, at one time or another. We are an aggressive species and offensive defense is a survival technique and as in a situation as Waco, when the cops are outnumbered and the general rule of bikie gangs is based on intimidation and often violence then survival techniques kick in.

May be if all bikies, (1%'s), stop being so anti establishment and making there own rules and be dammed with society rules, the coppers wouldn't have been in the situation in the first place, and they could have been out catching some vicious drug dealers or a bent politician or cop , or maybe some idiot causing killings on the road because they can't stay off their social media for 5 min.

 

[DIRTY DOG]

Cant judge a good guy and a bad guy just because one wears a uniform and the other doesn't.............. are you really that naive.

Human nature being what it is means we all deceive others, and ourselves, at one time or another. We are an aggressive species and offensive defense is a survival technique and as in a situation as Waco, when the cops are outnumbered and the general rule of bikie gangs is based on intimidation and often violence then survival techniques kick in.

May be if all bikies, (1%'s), stop being so anti establishment and making there own rules and be dammed with society rules, the coppers wouldn't have been in the situation in the first place, and they could have been out catching some vicious drug dealers or a bent politician or cop , or maybe some idiot causing killings on the road because they can't stay off their social media for 5 min.

well thats what makes them 1% er's lol

 

[member3480]

Unless you been in one of these clubs or hung around them you will never know HOW THINGS WORK. There are bad guys and good guys..... There is the baseball team and the Football team and then the rest. BUT everyone is not as bad as they make them out to be and most are VETS that just don't fit in.
I read on the web that one guy who got out said he and his wife heard three POP POP POP and the a lot of automatic guy fire and they ran and didn't look back.
Now TODAY you got to be nuts to do anything with all the VIDEO out there you are on some camera or many.