Whiring noise from bottom RH case

Q

Quilty

XS650 Enthusiast
Messages
60
Reaction score
0
Points
6
Location
Dublin, Ireland
After doing some extensive research on xs650 sites I've come across several people that have the same problem but it doesn't seem to be resolved on any thread.
Anyway I have a whirring noise related to rpm not speed I have listened to it with a stethoscope and I believe it's loudest on the RH case near the kick starter. I've eliminated the tacho the cam chain. The bike had a full top end job done 1000 miles ago. There was metal in the oil filter but no plastic. I assumed it was the no 4starter gear since it was chewed up and wasn't working and I replaced that. It's definatly a bottom end problem but I won't open her up till I get some advice from you guys first.
Grateful as ever
 
If you don't want to loose the oil, lay it over on a good slant and remove the RH cover.

If you are not concerned with oil, you should change it now anyway, remove the cover.

You know it is in there so go take a look, it is the only way you will know.

If something it loose behind or near the clutch you have a problem and need to take a look.

Good Luck.

biker.net for a manual
 
Last edited:
back of the clutch carrier rubbing on the crankcase possibly due to wear on the shim washers?
Only way to get to the bottom of this is to drain the oil and remove the cover and take a looksee.:(

First part of this video shows the problem

ha ha I see you beat me to it Brian . Good tip about tilting the bike to retain the oil !
I was wondering if 10-20 seconds running on tickover to locate the source of the noise (without oil) would do any damage
 
Could also check to see if some part of the shifter is contacting the backside of the clutch basket. The shift shaft has a retaining clip, located on the left side of the engine, beneath the sprocket, that prevents it from sliding in too far.

A quick test is to grab the shifter and try to shove the shiftshaft in-out. Should be less than 1mm movement. Any more, check for that clip on the shaft.

Elsewise, you may get some ideas from this thread. Warning, it's long, like a book, and will blow your day.

http://www.xs650.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23162
 
Ok so no wobble from the clutch basket but I noticed that the kickshaft oil seal is missing and there is an extra washer on the end instead. There's also a good bit of free play in the kickstart assembly. I can shove the whole thing in/out about 2 mm I think the sprocket on the other side is stopping it from moving any further.
 
the extra washer may be a shim installed to take up the lash on the shaft.

Did you remove the clutch assembly to check for rubbing ?

or take a measurement behind the basket with a feeler guage ?

A picture sure would be helpful :wink2:
 
Couldn't remove clutch assembly don't have anything larger than a 27mm spanner or the clutch removal tool. Thought I could grip one of the clutch plates with pliers to stop it moving. Turns out you can't :-( how much free play should be in the kick shaft assembly or is that a stupid question since there are springs positioned there? Think that extra washer belongs to the outside of the assembly between the oil seal and case. Will post pics later when I've my laptop on
 
the clutch lock nut is 27mm but you could use an imperial 1,1/16th inch socket/ring instead. Worth buying one as it fits the sump nuts too


You can remove the nut without using a special clutch tool. Just stick the bike in 1st gear ! thats all I did .

If you look at the first part of my video you should be able to see the area of the crankcase you need to check for grinding damage. You might see some evidence without removing the clutch.
Have you checked your oil filters and magnetic sump nut for metallic deposits that might indicate wear ?

You should have a loose washer on the kickshaft between the kickshaft assembly and the inside face of the cover .The washer is a shim to remove any float the kickshaft assembly has when the cover is fitted. I found that the washer is the same size as valve spring washers.
You will need to fit the KS assembly and cover then measure the float ,remove the cover and fit a shim washer of sufficient thickness to eliminate the float to whatever clearance tolerance is recommended. If its too tight it will stop the kickshaft assembly from turning when you kick it over.

Here you are. I scanned a page from my Chilton's manual.
The washer is part 11 'Shim'
 

Attachments

  • kickstart exploded parts.jpg
    kickstart exploded parts.jpg
    114.7 KB · Views: 129
Last edited:
sorry Philip but the camera moves away just at the critical point and I cannot see what is moving.

The kickshaft assembly will wobble a bit because your cover is off, so one end of the shaft is getting no support from the cover . :wink2:

It would be helpful to see just a still image of the kickshaft assembly . I cannot see your return spring on the spigot ? The spring looks like it may have broken but its difficult to tell.

The whole assembly is very easy to remove . You just need to pull the spring off the spigot with a pair of pliers and release the tension in the spring then the whole thing just pulls out.

If you look at my video you'll see how it goes in and removing it is just the reversal.

Once out you can dismantle the whole assembly and check it over .

I suspect that the reason that you have no oil seal is because the kickstart assembly wasn't fitted correctly in the past and pressed the oil seal out of the crackcase cover when the cover was fitted

 
The kick-starter works well. However the spring doesn't quite look like the condition yours does everything seems to be present and in the right place but quite loosely on the shaft. By the way I like your videos peanut. Very informative. My xs is a stock 72 by the way
 
well thank you kind Sir :D (peanut blushes).....

Carbon, Airwolfie, Anlaf and others have made some excellent tutorials too and really worth checking them out and subscribing to them :thumbsup:

Perhaps your kickstart spring is weak ? the whole assembly should be nice and tight otherwise the spring will not return the kickstart .

Whilst you have the cover off you might as well remove and dissassemble the kickstart assembly . Its very easy to do and you'll have a better understanding of how it fits together and works.:thumbsup:
 
Kickstarter is good removed it dissassembled it everything is where it should be. Clutch nut is definatly not a 27 mm which is weird so am gonna go and buy a 30mm socket tomorrow and take the clutch basket off to check for rubbing ect. One other thing that's bugging me that may be related to this was the rotor flywheel seemed to wobble when I was timing the engine with the strobe light. Is it possible that the rotor is the cause and the sound is travelling along the cam shaft to the other end through the clutch? Thoughts
 
I watched your video Gary, mine is nowhere near as bad as yours. I will use the starter and spin it tomorrow. I'm hoping / praying that's not the problem.
 
Thanks twomany, after looking at the thread and watching the videos that looks more like my rotor. However I've no charging issues and I use the kickstart mostly could that be the cause of the whirring noise I'm looking into. As I said before it is loudest with a stethoscope at the bottom of the RH case near the kickstarter. Also after reading a bit more about crank wobble and finding metal shavings in my oil I'm sadly convinced that's the cause of the whirring I think I'll have to open her up and have a look see, although im baffled as to the location of the noise. It doesn't sound like the crank area. I'm not looking forward to paying someone for the priveledge of splitting the cases
 
Quilty said:
T I'm not looking forward to paying someone for the priveledge of splitting the cases
Click to expand...

Don't be too downhearted . You are quite capable of disassembling and reassembling your motor . Most of it is very straightforward and there are at least three of us that rebuilt our engines for the first time last year and each of us have done some extensive video sequences and picture-heavy how-to's . Plus there is masses of videos and help available on here from real experts with answers coming literally as fast as you can post the questions.

Before you think about that ...I would drain the oil and remove the cover and start and run the bike on idle for 20 seconds or so that it will take you to identify the source of the noise . If your engine has run recently there will be plenty of residue oil on surfaces to protect them for the few seconds it will take.
 

Similar threads

authenticnovelty
1978 XS650E Standard - Consistent Whining Engine Sound
2 3
Replies
44
Views
7K
lakeview
lakeview
luckynumber0
My Rebuild
Replies
1
Views
852
TwoManyXS1Bs
TwoManyXS1Bs
Juicyk
Noise from bottom end! HELP!!
Replies
2
Views
2K
marp68
marp68
Tim of DO THE TON
Assembling top end of engine before sealing up the bottom
Replies
8
Views
741
Tim of DO THE TON
Tim of DO THE TON
scott s
'78 carbs/engine parts on a 256 motor?
Replies
3
Views
764
gggGary
gggGary
Back
Top