Help identify XS 650

[MOSFET]

Hey guys, I'm trying to understand what kind of a model am I exactly dealing with here. I believe it's a modified (by someone) 'Special' model, but I'm not sure. Can anybody confirm?

Here's what it says on the tag:
XS 650 SE
3L1-040350
79/6501

So as I understand, it's an 1979 model, but what confuses me, is that the engine no (040350), according to some sites on the interwebs, can not be on a 79 year model.

This motorcycle was bought from Germany.

Sorry about the low light pictures

 

[fredintoon]

Hey guys, I'm trying to understand what kind of a model am I exactly dealing with here. I believe it's a modified (by someone) 'Special' model, but I'm not sure. Can anybody confirm?
Here's what it says on the tag:
XS 650 SE
3L1-040350
79/6501
So as I understand, it's an 1979 model, but what confuses me, is that the engine no (040350), according to some sites on the interwebs, can not be on a 79 year model.
This motorcycle was bought from Germany.

Hi MOSFET,
according to this site's model ID chart the bike is an 80/81 US Custom Euro model.
The numbers start at 3LI- 040000 so yours is amongst the first of that batch and was likely built in September or later of 1979.
The US Custom would explain the missing leftside front brake and the EURO would explain the metric only speedo and the different rear indicator placement.
Not sure about the aluminum rim wire wheels in that model year though.
WTF, could be part of the Euro styling or coulda been swapped in later, like I did.
Nice looking bike anyhow.

 

[MOSFET]

Hi fredintoon, and thank you for the info. I have one more question though, regarding the wheels. Weren't the 'Special' models of this year supposed to have alloy wheels? Or are the spoke wheels another US Custom model thing?

EDIT: alright, got it, cheers.

 

[650Skull]

This thread will help you.

According to my chart, it is a US customSG 3L1-020101 to (040000).

Engine no matches the frame. Frame looks to be a Special, (shock angle indicates this). Check out the frames in the link i posted and look at the rear foot-peg mount, this is the other main difference between the standard and special frames.

The US Custom had Mag wheels and disk brake rear so the swing-arm has been change or modified to suit the spoke wheels. The wheels, (19F/18R, w style mud catcher rims), are from a standard.. Gauges have had some modification, tower with warning lights has been removed, Tower had the indicator, neutral and headlight fail warning lights. Must be a bitch to find neutral

Your pics are so bad i can't blow them up to look at the details to confirm some points.

Had this pic in my files.

Haven't got around to adding European models in the ID thread yet.

This is the first confirmed US custom i have come across. I will add it to the PDF ID Chart.

 

[650Skull]

There are some anomalies. An SE is a 78 model and you have 79 6501 on the plate.

But the numbers and visually, (Seat, Rear tail-light, grab-rail, rear indicators), the bike says 80 US Custom.

Post the month the bike was produced, it could help clear up the 79 part. Bikes were made from Aug to July so spanned 2 years, but the production model was classed as the last of the 2 years. June 79 was a 79 model, Oct 79 was an 80 model. There were some variations close to the swap over date so the dates didn't actually indicate the exact model.

Confused, Lol

 

[MOSFET]

That's what I thought, where the hell is the neutral light, lol. This bike arrived to me just today in this condition. Here's are some additional photographs (I did my best with my phone's crappy camera, it's 11 pm here):

 

[MOSFET]

In the documents, that came with the bike, it says the registration date to be July 1979, I'm not sure where to find the production month.

 

[650Skull]

I would say the frame is defiantly and 80, seat latches look original. That black triangle looking box by the kick-start lever in the last pic was for the Yamaha security chain that come out with the later Specials.

Odd because the reservoir for the disk brake models war there so if that box is original then your bike didn't have the disk brake rear.

Gota go will post more later

 

[MOSFET]

Thank you 650Skull, I can make better pictures in the morning in daylight outside.

 

[ridgerunner1965]

odd to see a bike with the cast tail bar and drum rear brakes. could that of been a euro thing?

 

[fredintoon]

Hi fredintoon, and thank you for the info. I have one more question though, regarding the wheels. Weren't the 'Special' models of this year supposed to have alloy wheels? Or are the spoke wheels another US Custom model thing?
EDIT: alright, got it, cheers.

Hi MOSFET,
FWIW, Canadian Specials came with 7-spoke cast wheels.
The Canadian '80 Special had a disk rear while later models reverted to a drum rear.
All the US Specials that I've seen photos of had megaspoked steel rim wire wheels although cast wheels may have been an option for them.
Your bike has the Special's small gas tank, the '80 & later aluminum grab rail and lift-off seat & it's posted that it has the Special's shock lean angle.
It also has what look very much like the '76 Standard model's deep groove (18" rear) aluminum rim wire wheels.
And Oh my, the box for the security chain. Didja ever see the lock & chain that was in it? The lock was worked with the ignition key but the chain was perhaps sturdy enough to walk a medium sized dog with.

 

[5twins]

The older style alternator and mechanical regulator indicate a points model. We got the electronic versions of those systems in 1980 here in the States. The oil site glass right engine cover didn't come along for us until '81. What carbs came with it? BS38s or BS34s? None of this is a true indicator though, it all could have been swapped around by a previous owner. Our steering neck tags have a month/year manufacturing date stamped on them, not sure if yours does though.

 

[jay760]

Around 1980 they brought out a custom with cast drum brake wheels which yours must have originally had, must have been swapped for standard/roadster wheels at some point, apart from the rear mudguard being far too long every thing else looks right for the year, if you look here http://www.xs650.org.au/Buyers Guide.htm you'll find it as 81 and 82, with drum rear, though I've got a 1980 from Australia in the garage that originally had cast wheels with a drum rear brake and the alloy grab rail.

Just read 5twins post, above mine also came with points ignition as standard.

 

[fredintoon]

Around 1980 they brought out a custom with cast drum brake wheels which yours must have originally had, must have been swapped for standard/roadster wheels at some point, apart from the rear mudguard being far too long every thing else looks right for the year, if you look here http://www.xs650.org.au/Buyers Guide.htm you'll find it as 81 and 82, with drum rear, though I've got a 1980 from Australia in the garage that originally had cast wheels with a drum rear brake and the alloy grab rail.
Just read 5twins post, above mine also came with points ignition as standard.

Hi Jay760,
your address says Somerset. Your use of mudguard rather than fender hints that's the original Zummerzet, not one of the several US ones?
MOSFET's says Estland which Google says used to be called Estonia.
If so, he's used to the European models of most bikes, which all tend to have rear mudguards of a sensible length instead of the stylist-imposed truncated ones that North American bikes are stuck with.

 

[650Skull]

Around 1980 they brought out a custom with cast drum brake wheels which yours must have originally had, must have been swapped for standard/roadster wheels at some point, apart from the rear mudguard being far too long every thing else looks right for the year, if you look here http://www.xs650.org.au/Buyers Guide.htm you'll find it as 81 and 82, with drum rear, though I've got a 1980 from Australia in the garage that originally had cast wheels with a drum rear brake and the alloy grab rail.

3W6 80SG Australia models had disk drum rear brakes, the 5A9 81SH had the drum Mag rear brake.

I have found that there was some 5A9's made and stamped in the late 81/82 so what would commonly be regarded as an SJ was stamped 5A9 SH. 5A9 81SH was the last of the Oceania models made for Australia and all models made for here had points. The Aussie club site has the 83SK Drum mag rear posted but it was only made in Canada. The 82K Heritage Special has the 46/64 spoke wheels made for the US market

 

[650Skull]

Hi MOSFET,
FWIW, Canadian Specials came with 7-spoke cast wheels.
It also has what look very much like the '76 Standard model's deep groove (18" rear) aluminum rim wire wheels..

The alloy W wheels ran on 74 to 79 Standard models and the 80TX Japanese Standard frame model

Check out the brochures in the ID sticky. Shows the US Specials had a choice of Spokes, (19/16) and Mags, (19/16), from 79-81

 

[650Skull]

Here are some links to 80 US Custom XS650's

1
2
3
4
5

At the end of the day brochures are the only real indicator of what the bike was sold like but there could have been options. Although i have never come across options that were not aftermarket. Never really know though

 

[650Skull]

The older style alternator and mechanical regulator indicate a points model. We got the electronic versions of those systems in 1980 here in the States. The oil site glass right engine cover didn't come along for us until '81. What carbs came with it? BS38s or BS34s? None of this is a true indicator though, it all could have been swapped around by a previous owner. Our steering neck tags have a month/year manufacturing date stamped on them, not sure if yours does though.

Our 80SG had the sight glass and mechanical regulator/points model.

 

[MOSFET]

What carbs came with it? BS38s or BS34s?

Previous owner said that it has BS34s.

MOSFET's says Estland which Google says used to be called Estonia.

It's Estonia yes, I just sometimes like to call it by it's Germanic name.

Anyway, thank you everybody for your input, I highly appreciate it. I'll definitely go through this forum and the brochure thread more deeply, to get a better understanding of this bike.

Here are a few more pics just for the hell of it.

 

[weekendrider]

650Skull
Were the rear signals placement and little reflector centered on the fender SOP for the Euro models?