Ignition Unit?

[PonyRide]

I will be rebuilding my project in the future but in the meantime have things listed on Ebay to sell. Do I need the Ignition Unit to run the bike with a PAMCO and PMA? I would like to sell it because they go for a lot. I'm guessing it is only necessary if running an electronic ignition?

 

[Dakota_Lew]

You mean the CDI unit? I assume your bike is between 80-84? If so the short answer is yes. Unless You put in a mechanical advance unit, or one of Pete's e advance.

IMO, sell it and get one of Pete's e advance and make sure you have a newer PAMCO.

 

[XSLeo]

A slight correction here, The XS650 never used a CDI, It used a TCI.
The Pamco replaces the stock ignition. So yes you can sell the complete ignition. As you are going to a PMA then you can sell the charging system as well. Some of the ignition parts are mounted in and on the charging system.
Leo

 

[Dakota_Lew]

Some reason, double posted sorry...

 

[Dakota_Lew]

Oops my bad TCI . Wait now you got me confused Leo, he still needs a mechanical advance unit. He probably doesn't have that.

 

[XSLeo]

He is swapping to a PMA. If his bike is an 80 up, the PMA won't work with the stock TCI. The pick ups on the stator and the magnet in the rotor will be gone. No way to mount these parts in the PMA.
He will need to replace the ignition, The Pamco's come in two versions. The originals uses the stock points ATU. Advance Timing Unit. The E-advancers don't use the ATU but still needs the Rod and bushings. A kit such as Mike's #14-0913 Has the parts he needs.
Then with Hugh's Handbuilt's PMA kit he'll be good to go.
Leo

 

[Dakota_Lew]

Whew, had me sweating there for a moment haha.

 

[PonyRide]

It is a 78

 

[PonyRide]

So to be clear it is a 4" by 4" by 1" black box with 6 wires that come out of it all going to one plug. It is Hitachi and reads TID12-01B on it as well as 4M4-10. When opened there is a circuit board inside. Again it is off of a 78. Pretty sure you guys have already answered what I was asking but just wanted to make sure.

 

[5twins]

The '78 didn't have that component. It had points and an advance unit. The bike may be a '78 but maybe the motor is not?

 

[650Skull]

Nothing adds up for this bike. Lots of mixed and matched parts.

With the bike in parts how do you know if the igniter was any good. If in good working order they are worth anywhere between $60 and maybe with lots of mystic help $180 if you are trying to sell it on ebay.

Non tested then not worth shit

Give us the frame and engine numbers for some help, to identify the bike and motor.

The info i go off has the 79 Special II starting at 2F0-250101. The lugs holding the side-covers on the Special frame look to have holes for grommets, on the bottom and round rubber grommets on the top for the plastic side-covers, (80SG/81SH/81H/82J/83K), not slits for the bottom latches or the lugs on top for metal side-covers the 78SE/79SF or 79/80G Special II has.

Wheels from an 80/81 Special II

 

[XSLeo]

Your description of the black box id's it as the TCI box for an 80 up bike. As mentioned the 78 had points. Your engine may or may not be a 78. It don't matter much.
The TCI ignition can be put on any year. You just need to swap the alternator rotor and stator. Easy to do.
I have an 82 stator and rotor on my 75. If I can do it anyone can.
Using the numbers stamped into the steering neck and on the engine by the front engine mount will id the years the frame and engine are.
These numbers are important but most everything on these bike can swap around. Carbs, exhaust, front ends, wheels, swing arms, bars.
If yours is a collection of parts from many years, that's ok. My 75 still has the 75 frame and engine but everything else has come from years 75 up to 82. It all works together just great.
Leo

 

[PonyRide]

First of all I would like to thank everyone for their input on this topic. I really appreciate all the info. The numbers on the frame are 2F0-05536 and on the engine are 4N9-001448. I wondered about this before because I didn't know if these numbers should match or not.

 

[XSLeo]

From the factory the engine number matched the frame number.
Finding mismatched numbers now is common. Some find it quicker and easier to swap engines than rebuild.
Your first number is missing a digit, after the 2FO there should be 6 digits. The 2FO numbers were used in 78 and 79. The 4N9-001448 is an 81 XS650H Special II.
The 78-79 frame came with points. The 81 Special II came with the TCI.
If you have all the TCI parts it is a good ignition. At this point in time they have started to fail. Some are easy to fix others can't be.
If it was me and I had all the TCI parts I would try to use it. If you can't get it to work or don't have all the parts then the kit as described earlier and a HHB PMA will get you there.
Leo

 

[Grader]

Sorry I don't mean to hijack the thread but I didn't want to start my own as this one seems to be on the same track.

I bought the bike from a local guy who told me the motor was a kick start only from a 1970 xs650, ans that the frame was from an 84.

He re did the wiring, all that is hooked up to my knowledge are the basics, lights, signals, ignition, horn and i think that's about it.

I'm rebuilding this bike and today I popped off the covers of the electrical box and found an ignition unit inside, now what I'm wondering is this,
If the motor is I fact a kick start only motor, what is the purpose of this black box?

I'm wondering because I would like to replace the stock components with pamco parts, and also wondering if this " ignition unit " would mean I have 1970's wiring or 1984 wiring, and also if I could ass an electronic ignition.


Thanks

 

[XSLeo]

It may have the 84 TCI ignition in it. If it does the alternator will have a TCI pick up on it. I'll post a pic of one.
Notice the black oval shaped thing, that's the TCI pick up.
If yours has this then it is using the 84 TCI ignition.
It may have an aftermarket ignition on it. Some of those used a black box.
A pic of what you have will help us help you.
Leo

 

[Grader]

Thanks xsleo, attached is a picture of what I'm talking about

 

[Grader]

So can anyone tell me what this is, if I need it and what it's purpose is ?

 

[azman857]

It's the brains for the '80-'85 stock TCI ignition. Mounted under the battery box.

 

[Grader]

Thanks azman, any idea why I would need it on the bike as I was told it's a 1970 kickstart only motor?

sorry if my questions seem dumb, I'm new to bikes and treys to find these answers out on my own already, that's what brought me here.