National Flasher Relay Problem Month

[Vertooch]

Unscrambling wires has scrambled my brain.
I just rewired my '79 xs and I can't seem to get my LED signals to work. They turn on with the switch but don't flash. They just stay on.
I bought a Motrax flasher relay for Kawasaki from cycle gear as it was the only one in stock. I figured I was rewiring anyway so it wouldn't matter if the flasher relay had the wrong coupler.
The unit has a Black wire and a Red wire. Black is wired to the battery. Red is wired to the brown/white wire form the turn signal switch.
Again, the turn signal switch turns my signals on but no flash.
Is it the relay? Is it Kawasaki specific or am I missing something else?

Thanks everyone,
Vertooch

Tired of looking at it, I just wanna ride it

 

[gggGary]

#1 ride it.
#2 you would need a special flasher to make LED turn signals flash they draw so little amperage that they will never heat a standard bimetallic flasher element to open it.
My bad the motrax (should) work with LEDS.
Is he stock flasher removed?

 

[Vertooch]

Thanks for the reply gggGary

#1 You're right. Ride it. I'm just trying to button up my rewire before I finish assembly.

#2 Yes. The stock flasher is removed. I thought the Motrax would work too. That's where I'm stumped. I followed Kent D. Whites's wiring diagram with the edition of a few inline fuses. Everything seems to be working fine except my flashers.

I tried using the stock flasher relay and got the same results.

Thanks

 

[gggGary]

OK they shouldn't flash with the stock relay they should stay on, so that is normal. what about with no relay, do they come on?
Does this bike have a battery, is it charged up? Do you have a link to the Kent D. Whites wiring diagram?

 

[xjwmx]

If you take the flasher switch completely apart you'll see three solder joints in little cups. I never got my signals to work right consistently until I resoldered them. Others have had the same result. The joints look good, but they didn't get hot enough at the factory, or had something on the metal preventing a good solder joint originally. It goes for models other than the XS as well.

 

[Vertooch]

gggGary,

Here is a link to the wiring diagram I used. It's the first one shown (gray background)
http://www.xs650.com/forum/showthread.php?t=61

I get the same result using the stock relay as I do with the new flasher relay. Same goes for no relay. The switch works to turn on the signal but no flash.

Yes I have a battery. And points system. The battery is charged.

I picked up a cheapy two prong flasher relay from the auto parts store to see if it was maybe a faulty Motrax relay. Same results.

 

[Vertooch]

xjwmx,

It's funny you mention that. When I took the flasher switch apart I suddenly had a brown, brown/white, and dark green wire in my hand with a nice little dab of solder attached to the ends. They came right off.

I resoldered them. Brown/white going to the center cup of the switch. The others in the vacant spots left and right. It seemed to make sense with how the switch works. Maybe I soldered them to the wrong place?

 

[xjwmx]

xjwmx,

It's funny you mention that. When I took the flasher switch apart I suddenly had a brown, brown/white, and dark green wire in my hand with a nice little dab of solder attached to the ends. They came right off...I resoldered them. ...Maybe I soldered them to the wrong place?

It's universal. If they don't fall out in your hand, they'll come out with a little tug. Easiest and surest fix is to sand the little rim until it's clean and rough, tin it, and then solder the wires to that.

Don't remember which wire goes to which cup off the top of my head. Wiring diagram should tell you.

 

[gggGary]

OK if you get lights with no relay in place, then you need to check your wiring. The power to the handlebar switch comes through the relay. If the lights light with no relay in then the power is not going through the relay, it has to be bypassing it somehow. Good luck but the circuit is pretty simple. Stock the Black is ground, the yellow green is from + 12 volt and the brown white goes to the handlebar switch.

 

[Vertooch]

Ill correct that gggGary. I thought you meant to try the switch with the relay bypassed. My power feeds the relay and the brown/white from the switch feeds the signals.

 

[gggGary]

To avoid confusion let's say flasher not relay (unless you have a relay too)
Being old school I'd throw a real load on it like two regular turn signal bulbs or a headlight bulb and see if the other flashers work. If they do the Motrax is defective, on other boards threads about Motrax a defective one or two were mentioned.
Also a bad ground somewhere is a possible culprit also.

 

[XSLeo]

I found that the electronic flashers need to wired just so to work.
I put one on mine, no flash. I reversed the flasher leads, works good.
You might try reversing you flasher leads. Red to hot, black to turn switch.

 

[Vertooch]

I put the original signal bulbs back on and I still get the same result. Signal lights on but not flashing.

I mentioned that I rebuilt the switch. Perhaps I screwed something up inside. I've got a new one on the way. I'll keep you posted on the results.

Thanks for the help so far.

 

[XSLeo]

If your lights light up on the left when the switch is pushed left, and the right side light when the switch is pushed right, The switch is fine.
The switch don't make them flash, the flasher does. Try swapping the flasher leads.
Try www.superbrightleds.com I'm using their LFS-1-pin, or maybe the LFS-1-flat. Any way it's the same flasher just different leads. $8.95 plus S&H
It will flash just one bulb or as many as you want up to 150 watts. And that my friend is one heck of a lot of LED's
It hooks in with the red wire to the hot side , black wire to the switch.

 

[Vertooch]

Thanks for the link XSleo. New flasher on the way.

Is it possible my 16 gauge wire is causing some resistance problems with the LED's? The signals came with a 20 gauge stranded wire. Super fine. I've got them connected to a 16 gauge wire that connects them to the switch.

 

[gggGary]

No, 16 gauge won't bother anything. As long as the lights are lighting there should be no issue with that part of the wiring.

 

[79yam]

i have the same problem mine is also a 79 ,
three types of flashers , i rebuilt my handlebar switch
removed canceler
and i'm all out of ideas

 

[XS650_Bobber]

I think the problem is that if you connect the flasher in wrong way it is damage, so, buy a cheap motorbike flasher that show L and B in the connections, L mean load and B battery, connect it and check, you can also check it without install it in the bike, test it with a bulb to a battery.

 

[TwoJugs]

If I remember right, you need to have the flasher polarity correct. Go for the LED flasher unit mentioned above, a standard flasher won't work with LEDs. Be sure you are feeding the power on the right leads. Some operate with power going to them through the switch. Others use the switch as a ground and the lights are always hot.

 

[XSLeo]

On the one I got from Super Bright, it will only work wired one way. Reverse the wires and nothing happens. Try plugging the flasher in so the leads are reversed. Or unhook the harness wires from the socket so you can hook the flasher both ways.
The Super Bright flasher has leads, one red one black. The red lead hooks to the brown wire, the black to the brown/white wire.
The flasher circuit is a simple one. Power is fed from the brown wire to the flasher, from the flasher to the switch, from the switch to the signals where it's grounded.
One way to test the circuit is to use a jumper. Remove the flasher. Check for voltage on the brown wire, if you have battery voltage on the brown wire plug a jumper from the brown wire to the brown/white wire. Now when you push the turn signal switch left or right it should light the signals. This won't flash the signals just light them. If they light the flasher is the problem. If they don't light somethings wrong with the wiring or the bulbs. Once you get the signals to light then try the flasher. Try it both ways.