Newb in need of help!!!!

[FastColt]

Hey guys, just would like to say hi to everyone first of all! My name is Chris, Im 29 and im from CT. This board seems really cool and very informative. A little back ground on myself, Im very mechanically inclined, I have an Evo RS I just finished up that will hopefully go 10's this season. Ive had a turbo Hayabusa that I built myself, and Ive built 2 other street/race cars. That being said.....

I had been looking for a xs bob project half started for about a year, a few weeks ago i finally found a 72 project that had been started (very poorly I might add). Basically I picked up a rolling hard tall frame, only tacked together, and a box of parts. No sweat right? WRONG!

As I started delving more into the engine, discovered that engine and frame are stamped with the same number (good), I believe the top end of this motor has been replaced(judging by the different colors). I also found that in the box of parts I had been given a 80's reg/rec combo instead of the seperate units. Now, after searching around a little more online tonight I think I have a newer style coil as well. Lastly I opened up the points covers and found I have no freaking points!!! Kinda pissed but oh well, i need to fix this situation. Here are a few pictures i took tonight and hopefully you guys will be able to help me out.

First of all, what side does the points go on? All the pictures ive seen so far have had them on the left side.There is nothing for the points to be attached to on the left side, on the right side the cam appears to be threaded.

engine right side

engine left side

Second, what the hell is this spare wire for that some idiot cut? All the wires have a home in the rec clip, this random one has no where to go.

Third, coil. Will this work? Or is it the wrong one.

Fourth, do the head/cylinders look to be not from the stock engine?

Any help you guys can lend would be awesome. Thanks so much!

 

[pa23driver]

the points plate attaches via the two empty tapped holes @ 11 o'clock and 5 o'clock on the left side cam cover. looks like you need to buy some bushings for the advance rod that goes through the cam shaft http://www.mikesxs.net/products-27.html#products part # 05-0033. and if you don't have the advance rod you need that too, and probably need the ignition advance unit as well - unless it's some where in your pile-o-parts (it goes on the right side).

the cylinders and head look to be correct

 

[pa23driver]

the lack of points parts and butchered wiring almost looks like the PO attempted to install an electronic ignition... or used a late model head that originally came with an electronic ignition - the latter being the most likely based on the missing advance rod bushings

 

[OakBehringer]

Yeah man, since you have to sort out some confusion with your points and coil, do yourself a favor and upgrade to PamcoPete's amazing pamco electronic Ignition with the "green monster" coil. It's well worth the money.

 

[XSLeo]

On your wire bundle coming up from the alternator. On the 6 wire plug, the three white wires come from the stator and go to the three whites of the reg/rec. There is a green wire, it goes to the green wire of the reg/rec. There is a brown wire it goes over to the brown wire of the reg/rec and then to power after the key switch. On the reg/rec this should leave you with a red and black. The black to ground. The red to battery positive thru a 20 amp fuse.
There is a blue wire in the 6 prong plug, it hooks to the neutral light. The yellow single wire goes to the safety relay. You can cap it off.
If you find a TCI box in your parts it will have a three wire plug to fit the three wire pickup plug. It will have a two wire plug that goes to the coil in your hand. Black wire to ground. To get power to the coil and TCI box hook the power to the red/white wire between the coil and TCI box.
If you look at this diagram, you can see how the TCI and coil hook together and get power from the kill switch.
It alsoshows how the combined reg/recgets hooked to your alternator.
Good luck on your project.
Leo

 

[FastColt]

You guys are great! I appear to be missing a shit ton of parts. I think my box o parts is just a box o crap.....I need all the parts pertaining to the ignition system I believe......damn......

 

[xschris]

Looks like a 82 engine. That should not have points. What are the numbers on the engine?

 

[littlebill31]

The TCI is a black, plastic box. Reg/rec, but I guess you know this, is a finned, metal unit. Whats on you stator/rotor assembly?
Get some pics of the crap layed out. Maybe someone can do a little ID on the parts.

 

[FastColt]

Xschris, that's what I thought too! The block matches the frame vin. But I don't think the cyliders and head are the original 72. I think someone swapped out somewhere along its life.

I 100% don't have the tac box either. Ill take more pics up today, hopefully I can get to the bottom of this mess.

 

[gggGary]

You sure you have a 72 and not an 82???? Give us the vin.
I am voting a Heritage special engine. again toss out the engine number. The Heritage specials had black cases and that looks a lot like factory case paint. All the wires on the engine are late model wiring. Picture of the front engine mount area of the frame will give us an idea of the year. If you have a working TCI box forget points and go with what you have.

Here's a year model guide with serial numbers down the page aways.
http://www.xs650.org.au/general%20info.HTM

 

[FastColt]

Ok guys, took some more pics, let me know what kind of mess i have going on here.

First pics are the matching vin's which i looked up and came out as 72 (i believe)

Next, i took a picture of the right and left sides of where the points are supposed to go. I noticed both sides have the solid grommets, odd? I thought so.

Next we have a few pics of the whole engine, stator assembly and clutch side.

Next we have a pic of the parts in the box, again this is all i received when i bought the bike....I have no clue what the top 2 are for, then obviously coil, reg/rec combo and ignition switch.

Lastly, a picture of the wires leaving the stator assembly (again, mystery wire in the middle??) lol

HELP!!!! LOL Thanks guys

 

[gggGary]

It's an 82 frame and engine no matter what the title sez....

XS-J HERITAGE 81-82 5V4 5V4- 000101
XS-K HERITAGE 82-83 5V4 5V4- 100101

To bad you don't have a TCI box but they can be found. It's that a Boyer, or a Pamco with the advancer kit (on back order at MikesXS)

 

[1Tlew0]

In refrence to the top 2 no clue. The one with the spring on it looks to be your brake switch. The other one im not too sure.

 

[FastColt]

Oh god im looking at the differences in harnesses from tc bros, the one I ordered for 1970 makes no sense, the 80-84 one makes perfect sense! Ill try and find a tci box i guess.

 

[gggGary]

Let me guess your carbs are black with chrome lids and have no choke knob.
Oh that's an 82-3 Heritage special rear wheel too.

 

[FastColt]

Correct sir. Now why is there an 8 pin and 6 pin option for harnesses on tc bros? I obviously need the 6 pin.

 

[gggGary]

You don't know which you need till you get a TCI box there are 6 pin and 8 pin TCIs,

 

[FastColt]

Sorry to ask such a simple but is there a specific tci I should look for? Also what exactly does tci stand for? And is there a difference between cdi and tci?

 

[littlebill31]

You can get the TCI on fleabay. Transistor Controlled Ignition.

Just as a note, Yamaha, and most other companies, started stamping all 17 digits on the neck in '82.

 

[gggGary]

IIRC no, the two extra wires control yet another "you are too stupid to do this yourself" relay.

Stolen from the yamaha vision site.

To be exact TCI uses transistor switches to disconnect the coils. This causes a charged coil to collapse and "fire" the spark. This is known as "Kettering" or "Induction" effect. So, in the VISION the coils are powered up all the time except while "collapsing" into spark. The VISION coils are constantly powered up at 12+ volts but the "induction" energy stored in the coils secondary core is about 20,000volts
[SIZE=+1]TCI is an "INDUCTION" ignition system[/SIZE] CDI systems use a different technique. While the pickup and triggering is the same, the output from a CDI ignition module is a short high voltage pulse to the coil. In a CDI system the coil doesn't store the spark but instead AMPLIFIES the pulse from the CDI unit to a much higher level. The pulse is from the CDI module is normally about 250-500volts. The CDI coil acts like a transformer and steps the voltage even higher. A CDI coil typically steps up the voltage 100:1. Do the math and you see a modern CDI coil is outputing 25,000-50,000volts (Oh-Baby).The spark coils here are wired directly to ground and are waiting for the high voltage pulse from the CDI module.