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Starter and starter relay
- Thread starter Capt_Zoom
- Start date
Hows the battery? Fully charged? It might just be dirty contacts on the start button.
At the relay unplug the blue/white wire, jumper this wire to a good ground. Does the starter spin? If so take the right side switch housing off and clean up the starter pushbutton and the bars under the button.
Connections at the starter, starter relay, battery. Power side as well as ground?
Use jumper cables, hooked up to your car battery, hook the negitive to a footpeg mount nut. Put a long bolt or screwdriver in the positive cable clamp. Now touch thius bolt/screwdriver to the cable lug on the starter. Does it spin? If not the starter has a problem. If it spins, move up to the relay, touch the bolt/screwdriver to the cable to the starter, does it spin? if not the cable and connections are bad.
Now turn on the key, touch the bolt/screwdriver to the battery side of the relay, push the start button, does the starter spin? If not the relay is bad,if it spins then the battery positive cable has bad connections or the battery is weak.
Leo
At the relay unplug the blue/white wire, jumper this wire to a good ground. Does the starter spin? If so take the right side switch housing off and clean up the starter pushbutton and the bars under the button.
Connections at the starter, starter relay, battery. Power side as well as ground?
Use jumper cables, hooked up to your car battery, hook the negitive to a footpeg mount nut. Put a long bolt or screwdriver in the positive cable clamp. Now touch thius bolt/screwdriver to the cable lug on the starter. Does it spin? If not the starter has a problem. If it spins, move up to the relay, touch the bolt/screwdriver to the cable to the starter, does it spin? if not the cable and connections are bad.
Now turn on the key, touch the bolt/screwdriver to the battery side of the relay, push the start button, does the starter spin? If not the relay is bad,if it spins then the battery positive cable has bad connections or the battery is weak.
Leo
On a Harley what they call the starter relay is pretty much the same as a lighting relay, like the 5 pin relay mentioned as a safety relay replacement. They can't carry the amps needed to act as the xs650 starter relay.
On the Harley's the starter relay just sends power to the starter solenoid on the starter itself. The solenoid is where the heavy cable from the battery hooks. It carries the amp needed to crank the starter.
In the books on the first few years of electric starters the XS650 starter draws 35 amps with no load, cranking the engine it can draw up to 75 amps with the decompressor lever pulled. I can't find a draw rating without the decompressor but I assume it's more. The starter switch is rated at 100 amps.
So any relat you get nedds at least a 100 amp rating.
On the Ford type solenoids they have two styles. Some have one small connection, some have two. The single connection are not an exact subsitute. It is designed to have power appied on the one connection and grounds throughthe body. this will work well with the car type key switches that have the start position on the switch.
The two connection relays have power in on one and ground out on the other. If used on a stock bike hook the red/white wire to one side, the bule/white to the other.
On rebuilding them yes you can drill out the rivets and take them apart to clean the lugs and washer or flip the washer. Used to do that on car starter solenoids.
As far as garden tractor relay being smaller, not happening they are the same relay.
From just looking at several places local the Ford relays cost more than Mikes XS and are much larger. Won't fit where the stock relay goes.
Leo
On the Harley's the starter relay just sends power to the starter solenoid on the starter itself. The solenoid is where the heavy cable from the battery hooks. It carries the amp needed to crank the starter.
In the books on the first few years of electric starters the XS650 starter draws 35 amps with no load, cranking the engine it can draw up to 75 amps with the decompressor lever pulled. I can't find a draw rating without the decompressor but I assume it's more. The starter switch is rated at 100 amps.
So any relat you get nedds at least a 100 amp rating.
On the Ford type solenoids they have two styles. Some have one small connection, some have two. The single connection are not an exact subsitute. It is designed to have power appied on the one connection and grounds throughthe body. this will work well with the car type key switches that have the start position on the switch.
The two connection relays have power in on one and ground out on the other. If used on a stock bike hook the red/white wire to one side, the bule/white to the other.
On rebuilding them yes you can drill out the rivets and take them apart to clean the lugs and washer or flip the washer. Used to do that on car starter solenoids.
As far as garden tractor relay being smaller, not happening they are the same relay.
From just looking at several places local the Ford relays cost more than Mikes XS and are much larger. Won't fit where the stock relay goes.
Leo
Ok got the starter working! It ended up being a bad conection but now when you press the start botton and get it started it seems to stay engaged for a few sec! I was thing to clean up the stuff inside the right side switches on the bars! Any body thinkbthat could be the problem?
Most of these bikes suffer from a grinding starter gear problem at some point in their lives. The problem is related to the drag clip on the #4 starter gear. A free fix is outlined here .....
http://en.650wiki.org/index.php/12.08._Electric_start_problem_fix
http://en.650wiki.org/index.php/12.08._Electric_start_problem_fix
If it's not engaging well then the wishbone spring is weak. If it stays engaged, it's a weak return spring. When you have the gear set out to snug up the wishbone, stretch the return spring out too.
That's the coil spring behind the gear set.
Leo
That's the coil spring behind the gear set.
Leo
Maclyn Monroe
XS650 Member
After rewiring my 1978 XS650, I only get a "click" from the starter relay. Determined the relay is bad. Ordered a new relay from Mike's XS and don't know where to mount the new relay. Has anyone replaced the old relay with a new one from Mike's XS?
Yes , starting at post #2019.
http://www.xs650.com/threads/mailman’s-xs2-a-full-on-restoration.51520/page-101
It is a little different but can usually be mounted in the same location.
One additional note that I didn’t mention in my thread, the original relay mounting bracket is designed in a way that locks it into place, so it won’t rotate with the one mounting screw that the factory used. The new relay is different, I still used just one screw in the factory location, but to help it stay in place, I put a rubber washer behind it, so that it kinda gets pulled into the washer and grips it when you tighten the screw.
Last edited:
Maclyn Monroe
XS650 Member
Thanks for info.
