Throwing it together before fall

[Art Vandelay]

It's been a few weeks but I've got a lot done on the bike and finally have time to upload some pictures. I'm waiting on a few last parts and then the wiring begins, hoping to have it started by the end of next week.

started off by striping it down to just about nothing and only putting what was necessary back on. ditched the stock bars for some drag bars, replaced the battery with a sparx capacitor and hugh's PMA, eliminated both fenders, removed stock wiring harness, and cut off the center stand. After that I removed all the frame tabs and mounts that were no longer needed and brushed on some satin black outdoor pain, it doesn't look the greatest but I just want to get this thing running before we run out of good weather here.

Next I found a hole in the case near the front sprocket, may have had a chain thrown through it at one point? I found some aluminum in the garage, it's a little thicker than the rib in the case but it shouldn't make a difference where it's at. It's a temporary fix for now and it's much better than letting water and dirt get into the charging system.

 

[Art Vandelay]

Sorry about the first picture being upside down, idk what was with that, they were all right side up before i uploaded them.

anyway, the next thing was the seat. I got some plywood and let it soak in hot water for about half hour and then clamped it to the subfame. it cracked a little on the outer most layer but I think I'm going go veneer over it to hide it. glued two layers of an old yoga mat and then a layer of thicker foam used for lawnmower seats from my old job. the adhesive is working as well as I'd hoped but when I get the vinyl on there it should hold the foam down and the glue is tacky enough to keep it from sliding around. Still waiting to see if a friend of mine will be able to sew the marine vinyl together.

Made a braket for my tail light from a piece of street sign that mysteriously showed up at my place. turned out alright except for the extra holes at the top, messed up on the layout and had it backwards. I see everyone blur out their license plates and I see I forgot to do that in the first pictures I posted. Is there some sort of risk of not blurring it?

Next was what I need some advise on, I cut out some wood for a rear mud flap and plate that all the electronics were mounted to. I can not decide weather to stain and seal them a natural wood color or paint them black to match the frame. My seat will be a dark brown so I was thinking the wood might look good.

The last thing to do before I can get it started and tuned is the electrical, I've got a pretty good grasp on it now but the headlight that I bought cam with no documentation and I have no idea how to hook it up. there is also a small light at the bottom and I'm not exactly sure what it is and how to hook that up. how do you get the lower voltage for the low beam or it it 12v for both of them?

 

[Airwolfie]

Looks like a good start!!

 

[Art Vandelay]

Got the bike started and in riding condition, it still has some lose ends and needs to be tuned but I've ridden it about 20 miles so far and couldn't be happier. This things rides better than I had hoped and pulls nice and strong for not being dialed it (must be pretty close though).

 

[Art Vandelay]

Damn, was hoping there would be a little more feed back. Thanks for the comment Airwolfie. The seat is getting skin soon, the frame rails are not the most comfortable but I have too much fun riding it to care. Just ridden it around the small town here, no highway yet but I'm thinking I might want to re-gear it, it has plenty of lowend power. It's running about 4500rpm @ 55mph, is there a typical ratio that everyone runs?

 

[retiredgentleman]

Damn, was hoping there would be a little more feed back. Thanks for the comment Airwolfie. The seat is getting skin soon, the frame rails are not the most comfortable but I have too much fun riding it to care. Just ridden it around the small town here, no highway yet but I'm thinking I might want to re-gear it, it has plenty of lowend power. It's running about 4500rpm @ 55mph, is there a typical ratio that everyone runs?

4500 at 55mph does not sound right to me. What rear sprocket do you have? Perhaps your tach is not accurate.

60 mph would be about 4200 rpm if you used 17 front and 36 rear. 60 mph would be 3800 rpm if you use 17/33.

There is no typical. Some use 17/30 as they like the low rpm's on the expressway. 17/32, 17/33, 17/34 are common. If you want tall gearing, some lads go with 18 on the front.
There is a spread sheet (by Pamcopete) that has all the combinations of gearing. Use the google search in the upper left corner to find the spreadsheet.

I use 17/33, and find its works very well for me. If you like snappy excelleration then 17/36will have you winning races from red light to red light, but not the best for the highway.

Headlight wiring questions.....................look in the "Tech" section under wiring diagrams.

 

[pamcopete]

Here is the Excel spreadsheet for RPM vs MPH for all combinations of gearing, sprockets and tire size. The yellow cells are pull downs for the values you want:

RPM vs MPH

 

[Art Vandelay]

Thanks for the replies, good info there. I was out of town the past few days but when I got home last night I found it has a 38 rear sprocket (still not sure about the front). However the gearing is the least of my worries now.

The engine has started to tick at cursing speeds, I tightened the cam chain and adjusted the valves right after I got it and it seemed to run smooth. The cam chain was pretty worn but I figured it should last at least until winter but I was wrong. Changed the oil yesterday and found aluminum shaving all over the oil filter and chunks of plastic in the slump. Now I have no clue what exactly is going on in there but I have a strong feeling it's the cam chain and guild, so it looks as though it won't be on the road until next spring

I figured while I have the engine torn down that much I might as well go through it and make sure everything is good. The PO told me he rebuilt the whole engine and replaced anything the needed replacing, obviously not! I guess it's true what they say about buying a used vehicle, "forget everything the PO said about it because it's probably all lies".

I don't know maybe since it'll be in pieces for the winter I should go ahead and rephrase it lol. Why not try and have the fastest bike around.

There was a lot of sludge on the magnets when I took everything out, all the other shavings were nonmagnetic (aluminum) is that normal or should I be worried about something else wearing out? It looked like the oil had not been changed for some time. I'm feeling really great about my purchase right now I've been told before to change the oil before you buy anything like this but I had tunnel vision going on and didn't have anyone with me to help. Lesson learned! the large light colored pieces in the pictures are gasket sealant (should have been a sign too I guess)

 

[retiredgentleman]

A 38 rear sprocket, sounds like gearing for hill climbs or stump pulling.

You will want a 32 or 33 for the rear.

Amazing how PO's can tell big lies right to your face isn't it. Your front cam chain guide is worn out. A top end re-build is the right thing to do. Once the engine is apart, you can measure components and see what all needs re-placing or machining.

I don't believe a rephase will make your bike faster than a stock engine. However, it will reduce your bank account. (opening here for all the rephase guys to jump in)

 

[Art Vandelay]

I was under the impression that a rephased motor would rev higher and have more power, with that extra power you could gear it ever higher and get more speed with out it being sluggish at the low end. maybe it's not worth it, just seems that the rephased bikes I see on online are faster and wheelie machines.

 

[Conrad Russell]

After reading a hole lot of post's on rephaseing and I believe it to be worth the money to reduce vibes.I also believe you will see those bikes produce more power from all the other tech work having been done.I am planing to do the rephase on mine only to reduce vibes which should help make every thing last longer and work better.Performance upgrade will mostly be in head work,carb,and exhaust.

 

[Art Vandelay]

Alright so I had my mind set on the fact that the bike was going to be out of commission until this next spring but I just couldn't stand it. We had and am still having some pretty nice weather around here and it was killing me to see everyone out riding so I decided to throw some extra money to a good friend of mine who works on quads and dirt bikes on the side and have him change the chain guide. I've known him since I was 13 and have always had him work on my stuff when I didn't have the know how.

We threw the bike on his stand (can not tell you how nice it is to work in a real garage!) and got to work. Had everything stripped down in about 2-3 hours and ordered the parts the next day from 650Central, I know it's been said a million times on here but Mike is awesome to work with! While I was waiting on parts I went ahead and cleaned up everything I could, cases, cylinders, heads, valves, ect... when the parts came in we bolted it all back together and all was good in the world, until about 100 miles later.

I started to hear the valve train getting loud and figured it was just the new cam chain setting in so I adjusted it. It was a little loose but even after I tightened it up and adjusted the valves and timing about 5-6 time (just to make sure) it was still ticking. I sounded just like it did before I took it apart so I changed the oil and sure enough there was little pieces of plastic and very tinny pieces of aluminum and some sort of fibers (I take it to be the plastic has fiber in it?). It's nowhere near as much as the first time and I put just about as many miles on it as before. I guess the guide came from MikesXS (ordered from 650Central), is this normal? dose it need to wear in or something? I've searched the web and can't find anything about it failing this fast, everyone just said that this motor is just noisy but this seems a little too loud.

I chanced the oil and figured I would run it another 50 miles or so and see if it gets any worse.

Lol sorry guys it seems like every post I make on here is a damn novel

 

[PatBroChill]

Bikes looking great, Im doing the same thing...trying to enjoy the weather while its here while making the bike look better and be able to ride as well. Hopefully your bikes little issues will have some easy solutions soon.

 

[nj1639]

I had a left exhaust valve that I would adjust and then it would loosen up after a couple hundred miles. Just had to crank the dogshirt down on the locking nut.
That ones on the bench for the elephant adjusters some time in the future......

 

[Art Vandelay]

Alright so it's been along and cold winter but I'm finally back out in the garage wrenching on the bike. As it sits right now the engine is completely stripped and ready for a little TLC. Turns out the cam chain guide has still good, cam was a little off center but everything seems to be ok. The plan right now is 1st oversized pistons, valves reground and seats cut, and new connecting rods.

I figure since i'm gonna be pressing the crank apart to replace rods I might as well twist it 3 splines and go for the rephase. I've been doing a lot of reading over the winter and I've got a pretty good plan for doing the crank and cam myself with a little help from the tool room here at work. I like how mrriggs dose his cams but I'm thinking about having 13 holes drilled (like the 13 spline in the center of the crank) instead of 2 sets of 3 holes, I'm modeling it up right now and I'll post some pictures when I get a chance.

I've taken some pictures of the engine as it was coming apart, I figured i'd just post them and if anyone sees any issues or has any concerns let me know.

The rockers have a small grooves where the cams rides on them, can these be used or saved or do they require new?

The valve stem ends and one of the spring retainers (i think thats what they're called) have some pitting, can the valve ends be ground to clean them up? there will be new tappets.

there was some white/silver deposits in the exhaust port that I've never seen before. is that anything to worry about?

There is also a crack in the cases that I did not notice before, it's right around what looks like a freeze plug where the shift cam needle bearing is. Hopefully the picture helps but would it be safe to patch that up with some jb weld? I haven't noticed any major leaks from it but it is pretty oily every time i take the side cover off.

The valve keepers also have a small dent on the top and bottom, the pictures of those are not the greatest but I didn't k now if those ever really go bad. I would replace them if I put new valves in but can these be reused?

Thanks in advance, someone on here always seems to know the answer or points me in the direction of some great info.

 

[hard_y_rd]

That crack you mention in the 10-11 pic is not a plug. It's a needle bearing assembly for your shift drum.Crack does not look good. Looks like oil seeping out of it. If your doing a rebuild, I would look for a new set of cases.

 

[gggGary]

Sorry to have to say that I agree with hard wired. Seen that one a few times. Some idiot PO ran the chain and sprockets till it was so stretched and loose it skipped a tooth on the front sprocket. On the way over the tooth the chain hits the LH cover mount and cracks the cases. You can see the grooves in the mount where the chain hit it. I wouldn't invest overhaul money into a set of cracked cases....... Talk to Jerm on here he might have a better engine to work with or know who does. The good news is that you are in Michigan where there are lots of these.

 

[Art Vandelay]

What would be the worst case scenario if I was to use the cases as they are or at least patch it up with a little jb weld. New cases were never part of the budget and I had always kinda thought of this bike as kind of my guinea pig. There is a 1983 650 special in a friends barn that I'm wanting to get and makes something special with.

PO's suck lol, I have read so many articles about buying used vehicles like this and what to look for but the tunnel vision set in and I just wanted it so bad. I guess "to be old and wise you must first be young and stupid"

 

[gggGary]

Yeah don't beat yourself up too much. I'd be willing to guess over 95% of all used bikes are bought with a cursory once over at best. It's true for me both buying and selling. I swear most buyers don't even look at the bike, they test ride it about a mile, hand me the cash and ride off. Well it's the shift drum not a trans shaft so that's a good thing. I'd try an XS650 engine needed in your local CL, give it a week or so, you'd be surprised at what can pop up. Don't be afraid to tell your sad story about finding the crack.