WHERE DID IT GO , IM AM WORRIED

fredintoon said:
Hi 'dude,
yeah, that's an old favorite but you'd better be able to interpret the Runes on the side of the can to make sure that WallyMart are still selling the good stuff.
Seems the EPA EcoNazis have castrated the ZZDP out of diesel lube too.
Click to expand...

Fred,
Hmm....
So, I read the interesting Ford article noted above (thanks, Gary). I am asking myself, however, If the internal stressors in our old engines are in the same league as the new Super Duty Diesel Ford engines which probably are expected to run 5k miles on their oil before the oil analysis is done? That is, do our XS650's really need the similar protection, especially if we dump our oil at 500 or 1,000? And we are not racing them (I don't) at high RPMs ?
 
Ok engine is out and top is apart lots of carbon build up on right cycliner left cylinder soaked in oil head gasket not good inlet ports again oiled ,slight scoring on cylinders nothing too bad will post pictures
 
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heres what it looks likehead gasket came away with top end oil got in underneath i think not sure to be honest .
DSCN2001.JPG
 
I need to order a gasket kit but my engine was rebored to 77.68mm would a standard Athena or Vesra be ok
 
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Earlier you said the plugs were good, but those plugs are not good.
3000 miles since a re-build??? Whoever did that re-build seems to lack some of the skills required to do a proper job.
 
yep 2M said it ! top end rebuild be sure to remove the piston ring grove.... if you don't remove the ridge at the top of the cylinder that the rings leave it will knock out your new rings in a few hundred miles.... just so you know !
Bob.............
 
Thanks for the advise ..will do I remember reading a thread about applying yambond to the head gastket ,I think it was 5Twins who posted it ,could be wrong .... it was about 2 years ago
cant seem to find it .It was about sealing the timming chain port arounsd the head gasket and oil ways i think ,as these engine seem to have that issue.
Also measured my piston barrels 77.68mm will a standard head gasket fit .
engines all stripped and cleaned , valve seated and lapped, de coaked the pistons and head , piston ring gap is right on the last tolerance so after hoaning will be slightly bigger ,i iinspected the rings with a 40x magnifier they had no score mark but the skirts on the pistons had a few.
Been working on the engine all day. Going to hone the sleves tomorrow at my friends garage then source some pistons rings from my Yamaha dealer in my town
hope you are all well,, all th best
 
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Here some pics of what i did today please comment if you see anything .. Im not sure about the gasket it seems ok to me, I am no expert though , I was wondering if the rings were the issue as the pistons were wet when i pulled the head,and that they at the end of the tolerance level ???DSCN2009.JPG oil may have passed up through the rings rather than the head Gasket ????? what do you think .DSCN2001.JPG DSCN2012.JPG DSCN2013.JPG DSCN2011.JPG DSCN2016.JPG DSCN2017.JPGDSCN2008.JPG All the best Thanks again
 
retiredgentleman said:
Earlier you said the plugs were good, but those plugs are not good.
3000 miles since a re-build??? Whoever did that re-build seems to lack some of the skills required to do a proper job.
Click to expand...
Hi sorry yes i did say that I thought they were ok like that what do you thing Retiredgentelman I have been trying different jets as the carbs were running very rich at first due to short exhaust pipes i opted for the longer exhausts and then rejeted each circuit finishing on the main
MAIN JET 140
NEEDLE JET 5HX13 NOTCH 3
NEEDLE Y0
AIR PILOT 135
PILOT JET 42.5
Book stated air pilot 85.... I tried this but the bike ran terrible. Again I am no expert but I let the engine and plugs tell me what needed doing by the way it reacted on what changes i saw and heard.
 
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Hi Funky, has your engine dropped a valve at some stage? First picture and last. You have not mentioned the valve stem oil seals, I'd be doing everything while the engine is out. Replace head gasket, I'd also go oversize as the ring gap is on the limit.
You've had a re bore already, whoever did the work did something wrong, 3000 miles? That's crap, plugs are crap, burning unevenly. Oil could be coming from bottom up, or top down...
What are the identifying marks on the pistons? Check piston to bore tolerance....

Cheers Mick
 
Hi Michaelo thanks for the input ... Are you refering to the dents on the rim on the first and last picture , it has not dropped a valve since i had it ... but i see what you mean ,,,
I took the valve stem oil seals off today got some new ones to fit. to be honest I have now idea what happened to this engine I was very carefull I ran it in with running in oil did the heat cycles changed filters and oil as instructed, used Mobil 1 Extended life oil change every 1000 miles maintained the bike well .But come to thinks of it I have been topping the oil up for some time, but only little amounts as i have been only doing small runs on the bike, Its only since i went to Bury St Edmunds a couple of days ago that i realised how bad it was burning oil 700ml for 126 miles .The chap that built my engine was Smed Speed he is well known for xs 650 rebuilds in the UK hes a nice ebnough chap, and races these engines does rephases all kinds of upgrade and stuff seems to know his stuff, I cant for the life of me work out what went wrong. I am not one for moping about the rebuild was not cheap I paid £2100 as you can imagine i a little pissed off but just want the bike back on the road. 3000 miles is not alot I will contact him and see what he has to say ... will check what you have suggested . thanks dude
 
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I'd be contacting Mr Smed, you might be surprised, check piston to bore clearance too, valve guides have a seal in them as well as the stem seals (large one with the spring on the top).
3000 miles is bugger all, its just been run in if that!
Oil, you can talk about oils here all day, my opinion, mineral oil, change every 1000 miles, over kill but it does it for me. Your burning a bucketload of oil, its a pity you pulled the engine before isolating where it was coming from....

Cheers Mick
 
I am glad that i pulled the engine as you can see the carbon build up was not good. and it was eating oil at high revs.
I have just E-mailed Mr Smed lol hes a nice enough fella he will not be pleased as he seemed proud about his work, I am sure.
I am not saying he 's the issue here or his work,what I am saying is I have no idea about why this happened as i did all that was required of me and more ....Just unlucky I guess. But in saying that I must be Lucky if thats all I have going wrong in my life ..... I am sure theres others out there with far more problems than one of there motocycles developing a probelm lololol
Thanks again all the best
 
Sorry Funky I have no idea about that ....
you might pull the breather off the head sense you have the head off the checkvalve could be stuck closed perhaps ? causing pressure to build and force more oil than usual past the rings ? I would think seals would be leaking if that were the case though.... i'm guessing ! I too want to know what went wrong..... the only thing I can think of that would take out Rings in 3000miles would be a ridge at the top of the cylinders take your finger nail and see if you can slide it from the cylinder bore to the top of the cylinders where the head gasket sits.... there looks like a Ridge about 3/16" from the top of the bore going down then the cylinder opens up a tiny bit more for the rest of the cylinder.... if that ridge is substancial it can destroy a new set of rings quickly..... usually you can re ring an engine and get away without having to remove that ridge because its very minor.... in that one picture it don't look very minor to me....... a piston ring ridge removing tool can be used to take that ridge down to meet the rest of the cylinder and the new rings won't bang into it when they come up. .... I happen to still have my old ridge removing tool too bad you don't live close to me ! LOL
you might be able to rent one at a parts place though they are adjustable for many sizes ..... mine is for 4" pistons so I doubt it would fit anyway LOL.....
....
I can't think of anything else that would make it smoke within 3000 miles like that...after a good rebuild.... but I know from experience in a car (ford falcon 6cyl) that I rebuilt that I left the piston ridge in there and I didn't get 100 miles before it was pumping oil like a gyser !
so use your logic.... that bike is a 4cycle as well as the car was it had new bearings and New rings so did yours mine died very quiclky yours you probably didn't notice till 3000 miles but the results are the same......
thats my best guess.....
if ya can't get a ridge reamer then re- bore or honing on that ridge only till it's down is your only hope I think !!!!
2M.... gggGary.... 5twins..... does this sound reasonable to you ? you know these bikes better than I do !
...Bob........
 
Bob nice that you are posting. Yes on old high mile cars a ring ridge is VERY common. I have story or two about that.
On this engine 3000 miles after a rebore the cross hatching is still there as one would expect, so no ring ridges.
I think it's safe to assume a lot of guys HAVE looked at this and other than that odd notch that Michaelo has pointed out no one has seen " a smoking gun" (sorry couldn't help myself). I guess I'll mention that the brown gold ring at the top of the bores and both plugs both seem to show evidence of oil consumption. I think thats pointing at a problem with some component spec or install method that caused BOTH sides to burn, rather than a single failed part. I am not an engine rebuilder so have no expertise in this deal. I do hope a definitive answer comes to light!
 

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