I finally got her back....

[Mackels]

It's been 5 yrs. sitting in a shed I just got it back this weekend. I have been lurking and learning for the past few weeks in anticipation of getting my bike back. I always thought I had a 77 special..but have since learned that I there was no special in 77. If you could tell me what I have, that would be much appreciated. I believe it is a 77 xs650d. When I bought it, the PO said that the PO to that individual took 2 77's and made one good one out of it.
I removed the tank and there was very little rust. I got the carbs off and attached a couple pictures. I also removed the oil. The magnets on the drain plugs were coated with metal filings. I still need to strain the oil to see what else comes out of there.
I am a noob and did not understand the work that needs to be done to keep this bike in good running condition. So I consider myself a bad PO, but looking to learn and get her back on the road in the spring.
I appreciate any and all help, however, I will not put up with BS from snickering members, that isn't the point of this site IMO.

Thank you in advance.

 

[5twins]

You have what looks mostly like a '77 Standard model but there appears to be some newer parts swapped on. That P.O. that assembled it may have used a '77 and a '78 or '79. The gas tank has vacuum petcocks which would make it '78 or '79. The chrome covers on the tach and speedo are from a Special. I can't I.D. the carb set 100% from the pics you've shown. The bowls are '76-'77 because they have an overflow pipe in them. The main bodies, I'm not sure about. I would need to see the intake bells.

Your air filters are K&N replacement elements. Those are very nice. You never need replace them, just clean and re-oil. You should be able to get a service kit at an auto parts store with the special oil and cleaner.

 

[mrtwowheel]

Metal in the crankcase........look at some of the pictures on this forum of the starter gears some guys pull out of these engines.

Scott

 

[Mackels]

Thanks 5twins I believe I have BS38's as the main is a 122.5 and the pilot is a 25. I am quite surprised as to how clean everything is.

 

[fredintoon]

It's been 5 yrs. sitting in a shed I just got it back this weekend. - - -
I appreciate any and all help, however, I will not put up with BS from snickering members, that isn't the point of this site IMO.
Thank you in advance.

Hi Mackels,
it's a Standard for sure. The frame is, anyway.
The Standard frame's more upright rear shock angle is about the only thing on an XS650 that can't be swapped between years and models just by using wrenches.
Even though your bike was assembled with parts from two others, apart from that aftermarket seat it looks like it ain't been messed with much at all.
As to the bike's condition, all that the photos show is that the carbs need a thorough cleaning.
Some things to know:- XS650s don't have oil filters. There's two wire mesh oil strainers to stop the chunks is all.
One's in the side, t'other is underneath. Check them both for torn mesh.
There are aftermarket replacements for both that have actual filters in them.
Stock strainers or aftermarket filters, change the oil often. Every 1,500 miles or less.
The XS650's roller and ball bottom end bearings wear out the oil's fancy anti-friction additives real quick.
And grow a thick skin for the BS. Whatever you do, or don't do, to your bike will bother someone.

 

[5twins]

Your carbs are '77 BS38s (or '76, same set). The two air jets on the intake bell at 4 and 8 o'clock confirm that, as does the jetting you found in there. The '78-'79 set has two addition holes on the intake bell at 3 and 9 o'clock. These are vents for the float bowl .....

 

[Mackels]

Metal in the crankcase........look at some of the pictures on this forum of the starter gears some guys pull out of these engines.

Scott

Thank you. I have seen the photos and the threads. My starter does/did the same thing, I will have to wait until I get to that portion of the lookover.

 

[mrtwowheel]

Thank you. I have seen the photos and the threads. My starter does/did the same thing, I will have to wait until I get to that portion of the lookover.

Just sayin', don't tear down the whole engine yet.

Scott

 

[vincejames]

Your carbs are '77 BS38s (or '76, same set). The two air jets on the intake bell at 4 and 8 o'clock confirm that, as does the jetting you found in there. The '78-'79 set has two addition holes on the intake bell at 3 and 9 o'clock. These are vents for the float bowl .....

Sorry to jump on your thread Mackels, this is interesting. Hey 5twins would the attached photo (overflow pipe indicated in red) indicate that these are 77 BS38s? I take it this was the only year they put these over flow pipes on the BS38s?

Thanks - Vince

 

[5twins]

That pic I.D.'s the float bowl as a '76-'77 one. The big "tell" (besides the overflow pipe) is the VM22/210 type pilot. All the 650 BS38 carbs from '77 and earlier had the overflow pipe. Only the '76-'77 set used the VM22/210 pilot. How can I tell the pilot type without even seeing it? Well, I'm actually not looking at the pilot jet but rather at how the air is fed to it .....

 

[Mackels]

Hey folks. Going through my carbs (with the guide) and I need new gaskets and o rings. Who has the proper fitting gaskets? Where should I buy them? Mikes? Bike bandit? Etc. Also I am thinking I need to get new o rings for my butterfly shaft. If you look at the picture on the upper right side it seems as if the butterfly valve is digging into the carb body. I don't have any up and down movement, but there is some left to right movement.

 

[gggGary]

I like to replace shaft seals, use the genuine Yamaha, every time. But that wear mark I think I am seeing is worrisome. Is that the LH carb? The late model BS38's tend to have less shaft bushing wear than the early ones but the one at the cable connection sees it first/worst. A seal will not fix a worn bushing carefully check asssembly order on the outside, someone may have messed it up pushing the shaft sideways? I suppose a badly mis-synched set could cause that too.

 

[Mackels]

I like to replace shaft seals, use the genuine Yamaha, every time. But that wear mark I think I am seeing is worrisome. Is that the LH carb? The late model BS38's tend to have less shaft bushing wear than the early ones but the one at the cable connection sees it first/worst. A seal will not fix a worn bushing carefully check asssembly order on the outside, someone may have messed it up pushing the shaft sideways? I suppose a badly mis-synched set could cause that too.

Yes that is th LH carb. I will check the assembly with my manuals. Is it too far gone already? I.e. Do I need new carbs?

 

[TwoManyXS1Bs]

I know how to set throttle shaft end-lash on the earlier dual-cable carb types, but not on these linked throttle types. If it was one of the earlier types, I'd set the shaft end-lash (butterfly won't drag then), reinstall carb, and see if it can hold a stable idle. If not, get another carb body (or a precarious patch job)...

 

[gggGary]

Or some ninja carbs (from what I hear) a set in a box in my shed has not improved any bike I own, YET. My resto is running so F'n awesome on the mildly rejetted 79 BS38's (5twins rocks) I don't DARE touch them!!!!!!!!!

 

[5twins]

I agree with 2M. You probably won't know if the butterfly shafts are worn out until you try the carbs. If you remove all the parts from the end of the shaft (spring, cable arm, etc.), it will move around freely and you could judge the wear a bit better. When the return spring is installed, it pulls the shaft towards it. If the butterfly plates were ever removed or even loosened in the past and then re-tightened without the return spring installed, the plate may not be centered in the bore. If you're going to replace the shaft seals then you will have the chance to remedy this.

 

[Mackels]

The plates have not been removed as far as I can tell, the backs of the screws still have the peen marks on them. The outer spring looks like it's too much spring for what it's trying to do.(see attached) Perhaps that is the cause of the wear. I can for sure feel wear with my finger. I want to follows ggGary's mantra of limiting the variables. So I will get new gaskets and o-rings 1st.

 

[5twins]

That looks like the normal spring (7 or 8 coils). Maybe it's preloaded too much? Usually, you hook it to the carb then hook the cable arm into it and rotate (preload) it just enough to get the arm on the shaft.

 

[5twins]

To check the butterfly plate fit and seal in the main bore, back the idle speed adjustment screw on the left carb all the way off so it's not touching the cable arm any more. This should allow the butterfly plates to close completely. Hold the air filter end of the carbs up to a good light and look in the other end (engine side) at the butterfly plates. Look for light coming through around the edges. If the plates are fitting and sealing correctly, there should be none. If one is open a little, the other closed, the carbs are out of sync. You can fix that by fiddling with the sync screw on the linkage between the carbs. What you would be doing here is called a "bench sync".

 

[gggGary]

compare but I don't see anything obviously wrong.