pamco with no battery?

[avenue]

maybe the cap./fuse is more like the transformer, the key being the A/C disconnect, and the six buss fuse panel is like the house's fuse panel.

either way, the transformer has a fuse (and blows up in a big way if something goes wrong). you want the fuse to be on the same line from the cap/batt to the key and beyond, with no other path.

 

[Phail]

I'm running PMA + Pamco + Cap just fine. Bike runs pretty good. A few months ago I wanted to put a battery in to help with the flickering lights problem. So I replaced my Cap with a battery. This worked great. The bike seemed to run better too.

I once was busy and didn't get out for about a week or so and my battery died. I was not able to start the bike at all. I was thinking that with the PMA I should be able to run on a dead battery just fine. Nope.

Maybe a larger Cap will help with flickering lights at idle. But won't help if my bike dies while going down the freeway in the middle of the night in traffic. That would suck. And this has happened when I ran out of gas once. Lucky I had a little flash light that I could use so cars going by would see me.

 

[Austblue]

Could someone please confirm for me that the red off the rec/reg goes to the positive on the capacitor? Just rewiring this bit now.

 

[XSLeo]

You want the main fuse between the power source and the main switch. In this case the power source is the reg/rec and cap.
So yes, run the red of the reg/rec straight to the cap. Then run the fuse from the positive of the cap to the main switch.
Leo

 

[shaunmayfield]

Attached is my wiring diagram that I was using, except it did not have a capacitor at the time I wired it. I have a PMA, Pamco and battery and thought about adding a capacitor so if/when the battery dies the capacitor will still start the bike. If the battery completely gives up I still have a dependable ride.

So my question is when wiring up a capacitor to an existing system I have been told, by Hugh, to "Just tie in the Capacitor to the Hot and Ground, and you are good to go." However (thanks Hugh), I am not that samrt and still needing a little help. So could someone tell me if adding that capacitor as shown in the picture to be tandem to the battery is good?

 

[pamcopete]

shaun...,

The problem will be if and when the battery dies, it could suck up all the juice from the PMA when you are trying to start with the kicker, so you would need some way to disconnect the battery when it is dead to allow the capacitor to work....

Also, in your diagram, you have the output from the PMA going directly to the fuse box so when you turn off the key, the PMA would still be providing power to the ignition so the engine would not quit until you also turned off the kill switch, but by then the entire electrical system would be fried because the regulator will go ape shit without the capacitor / battery to stabilize the voltage.....

So, basically, you whole wiring diagram is a mess.......(sorry!)

 

[shaunmayfield]

@Pamcopete, I have always killed a bike with it's killswitch then turn off the ignition (basically I flip the ignition and kill switch simultaneously). If the ignition switched was moved anywhere else besides the battery line then couldn't there be drain in the battery? I would assume that the positive needs to be switched off at the battery. Also I want all my fuses on my fuse block and not random one inline on the PMA circuit. Is it possible to switch off the battery and have the PMA fuse on the fuse block?

How would you remedy this? It has been working fine so far but I don't want problems down the road.

 

[pamcopete]

shaun...,

Well, that's funny because that's what I always do as well. Its easier to find neutral after you kill the engine with the kill switch but before you turn off the power with the ignition switch, but I always like to do things with the third party in mind. Not you...not me...but someone else riding the bike or working on it.

A compromise here would be to connect the capacitor directly to the output from the regulator before the fuse. The engine would still keep on going when you turn off the ignition switch but the capacitor would provide the smoothing to keep the regulator from going ape shit and you could turn off the battery with the ign switch if it is dead and still be able to kick start the engine just by turning on the kill switch.

What this arrangement also shows is that you do not need an ignition switch with a PMA and capacitor, no battery. When you kill the engine with the kill switch there is no power to the electrical system.

An even better arrangement would be this:

Now you can cut off the engine with either the master switch or the kill switch. The downside is the unprotected wire from the battery and the master switch are not fused. That is why there is generally a separate fuse close to the battery to minimize the danger of the main heavy gage wire from the battery from shorting out and frying the entire motorcycle...

 

[shaunmayfield]

Thanks for all your help.

Now if I put an inline 20amp fuse after the battery but before the PMA then the current 20amp fuse that is on the fuse block be redundant, and in that case run it back to the main post as before, correct?

 

[pamcopete]

Shaun...,

Well,the problem with a PMA is that it will continue to produce its maximum output even if there is a short somewhere wheras a conventional field excited alternator like the stock alternator will lose its excitation with a short and its output will decrease, so I thiknk that the PMA itself should have a fuse for that reason and the fuse should be located as close as possible to the output of the regulator. So, with that in mind, here is how I would wire a PMA if I had one one my bike:

 

[XSLeo]

I don't think adding a cap in with a battery makes much sence.
If the battery just goes dead from like leaving the key on.
I had a 74 Kawasaki H1 500. It had a PMA. I had left the key on and drained the battery. You could pull the main fuse and it would start and run fine. As soon as you put the fuse back the battery would start to charge and in doing so the drain on the PMA would kill the engine.
I found that if I just turned the bike on, engine stop switch off, kick the bike, it would charge the battery. Keep kicking until the neutral light would stay lit, even with it just glowing, turn on the engine stop switch, it would start and run fine with the battery hooked up.
A battery is a fairly reliable device. If good when put in the bike and the charging system is working right a battery seldom fails.
Leo