Tuning.....Where the hek to start!

[5twins]

Yes, you must set the points gaps first, then set the timing. Changing the points gap changes the timing slightly so that is why the points need to be gapped first.

 

[MaxPete]

There ya go - and don’t forget about the kill switch.

Hey - big day for me - I figured out how to follow Paul on Instagram.

No 7 year old required!!

 

[Paul75]

Congrats on the instagram!! I use it to see what awesome bikes are being build around the globe....what is your name on insta?

I already set the points gap BUT will try again tomorrow and make sure the kill switch is off....it may well be that! If not I'll try a smaller wattage bulb. I've got a timing light so will use once static is adjusted......

Thanks guys.....

 

[Paul75]

This is the static timing video I am using...

 

[5twins]

That video seems pretty good. Note how his bulb acts like mine - on when points open, off when they close.

A word of caution about static timing. Don't leave the key on with the bike not running for an extended period of time, like a half hour or more. Try to limit the "key on" time to just a few minutes at most. When a points set is closed, the coil it connects to will be charging up for the next spark. While running, this happens continuously but the coil gets to release it's charge when it sparks. That may not happen with the motor off. If it is sitting there with a points set closed, that coil will keep charging and charging. It can over-heat, even burn itself out, if left doing this for too long. So, turn the key on and do your static light bulb check, then turn it off while doing any needed adjustments. Turn it back on to re-check your adjustments, then off again as soon as you're done with that.

 

[Paul75]

Maybe a silly question but when I come to dynamic timing, is a xenon timing light ok? Since buying this I read somewhere that xenon isn't correct?

 

[mrtwowheel]

It's been a LONG time ago, but for static timing I always used a flashlight bulb and battery, everything held together with electrical tape, ignition off.

Scott

 

[MaxPete]

Baron8243

Maybe a silly question but when I come to dynamic timing, is a xenon timing light ok? Since buying this I read somewhere that xenon isn't correct?View attachment 110809

That’s the type of light I used Paul and to seemed to work fine.

One thing - the kill switch must be ON (not off) for the bike’s battery to be able to power a light when doing static timing. That’s another reason why the audible signal on a multimeter is nice - you don’t have to worry about heating up the coils.

 

[Paul Sutton]

2Many made a really cool LED setup for timing. Well worth reading if you want a neat little Winter project:

http://www.xs650.com/threads/an-led-ignition-timing-light-experiment.44586/
http://www.xs650.com/threads/an-led-ignition-timing-light-experiment.44586/
It is on my to do list.....

 

[grizld1]

Paul, consider getting a decent multimeter. You can use the 20VDC setting to check if power is reaching the points, and you can use the ohm meter setting for static timing with the ignition turned off (no risk of toasting coils).

 

[gggGary]

That’s the type of light I used Paul and to seemed to work fine.

One thing - the kill switch must be ON (not off) for the bike’s battery to be able to power a light when doing static timing. That’s another reason why the audible signal on a multimeter is nice - you don’t have to worry about heating up the coils.

An old mechanic I know will connect a test bulb ground to the points and the hot to the battery + terminal then watches for the bulb to go OUT at points opening, no key on needed.

 

[TimeMachine]

An old motorcyclist I know could set his friends dead XS750 triple 3 sets of points yuk, on the side of the Cascade mtn pass along the Santiam river after a beer, a joint, and letting it cool. With a bic lighter for light and a crappy screwdriver. It made the ride.
A running engine is finely timed with a Timing light !!

 

[mrtwowheel]

My memory is coming back. I'm of this mind........static timing is for setting the timing........after that, a timing light is used for "checking" the timing.

Thank you Paul75, for helping me recover.

Scott

 

[TimeMachine]

Static timing does not show the needed adjustment for the effects of advance weights and the motion of the ignition components in general. I always rely on the final readings of the timing light.
My memory tells me that static timing gets it close enough for a running evaluation

 

[Paul75]

An old mechanic I know will connect a test bulb ground to the points and the hot to the battery + terminal then watches for the bulb to go OUT at points opening, no key on needed.

So.....set the static using the bulb....it wasn't lighting up because the kill switch was on!!! As it goes though I wired it up like GggGary said and then you don't need to worry about the switch etc so all is good.

Fired the bike up and was really a huge improvement over how it was running before I started the tuning process.....no backfires, no misses etc.....sounded good with the pipes too so really happy.

I've then got the strobe out for fine adjustment BUT it's mark is about half an inch over to the right of the T, even when I adjust the right cylinder I cannot bring it clockwise enough to get it in the firing range.....any ideas?

 

[gggGary]

You often have to adjust the gap a bit to compensate for cam chain stretch and get left right balanced. Careful that any advance degree knob on the timing light is zero'd out, been caught on THAT oopsie.
PS the advance setting is MUCH more important than the idle setting. Eventually most say F-it and put in a pamco, now with the integrated advancer on the plate it's nearly a no brainer.
Inability to bring the timing in is natures way of telling you it's time for a cam chain and guide....

 

[grizld1]

OK, you know that idle timing is too far retarded. If advanced timing is also too far retarded, your cam chain is worn (as the cam chain wears, the tensioner pulls the camshaft and with it the ignition rod clockwise. If wear is bad enough, points can't be advanced far enough to compensate). If advanced timing is correct, excessive retard at idle is caused by wear at the tips of the bob weights. Plenty has been posted on this, seek and find.

Edit: Right, as Gary notes, correct advance timing is important because if advanced timing goes past 40* you'll be at risk of holing a piston. However with idle timing too far retarded, you'll experience hard starting and carbs popping out of the boots. Also right, playing with the gap will buy you a little slack, but it sounds as though your idle timing is almost at the TDC mark.

 

[Paul75]

Here are the bob weights. I don't believe there is excessive wear here?

 

[gggGary]

Have another cup of coffee this deary sunday morning Grizzly bear, advanced idle timing will pop the carbs off not so much retarded....

 

[gggGary]

Those weights look pretty good but comparing idle and advance timing with the light is the gold standard.
PS you can glue shims inside the weight stops to shorten the difference between advance and idle timing.

Do not be tempted to bend in the tabs, they are brittle and easily crack with disasterous results.