Why is the PAMCO better than points?

pnedac

pnedac

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I am building my first bobber. First build period actually. After years of just tinkering I decided over the winter to just dive in and go for it. I have a 77 XS650 that I found in a barn and now it is a pretty sweet bobber. I recently got it up and running but I have read that the PAMCO ignition is the way to go. Ditch the points! I keep reading about it, but can anyone tell me why it is so much better? I actually just ordered the PAMCO and the new coil to go with it, but I am just curious as to why it is better. I do see that I get backfiring and I see that although I have spark, it is not very strong. I even have all new OEM coild and caps, wires, and plugs. I am making the switch but I was wondering what it actually is doing for the bike in the long run.

Thanks!
 
The main benefit is not having to adjust timing and points all the time. The 650 points system works but not as well as some of the systems on other old bikes I have. Those others don't require nearly as much maintenance as the 650 did. You will also get the benefit of a stronger spark because of the new stronger coil you'll be running.
 
what i find is the pamco helps when im trouble shooting to get it fired up plus if you never messed with points pamco is way easy for newbies, the green coil gives a hotter fire so im told. i have a pamco bike and a points bike, i like the both but when the pionts bike starts running bad the frist thing i check is the points, pamco bike runs bad 1st thing is carbs, most of the time on eithr bike its the carbs
 
EI = more reliable, stable, runs better and hotter (usually)
MI = serviceable

EI is better in general but when something breaks, you're probably not fixing it.
 
That is very good info. Thanks you guys. I appreciate it. I think this will likely solve my little problem of revving too high. Brand new carbs and I have them set low, but when I put it in nuetral it starts revving way up there and does not want to come down. I was told it is the points and the timing. I guess it won't be the points once this PAMCO arrives. Sweet. I am getting pretty close to being done with this beast of a bike. Can't wait to ride it.
 
enh. there's a lot of reasons why it would rev high, but points would be last on my list.

Revving high is generally carburetion, I would think. Others may have differing opinions on this but the engine can't run fast without being fed the fuel to do so.

Obvious causes for this are throttle stop issues, binding throttle cables, cable tension too high, binding slides, etc.
 
Disclaimer: It's been 30 years since I really got my hands greasy with this stuff, but I'm about to again, soon. So...agreed...."just" replacing the points with electronic ignition won't fix this problem. There is nothing about points, per se, that would make the engine rev up like that. Are you able to look into the carb mouths when this happens to see if the slides are rising as the engine revs? If so (and I'll bet they are, then SOMETHING is making them do that. Keep us posted on what you find...and good luck.
 
I have brand new VM34 carbs and I have the idle set very low (almost to the point of suffocation). I had to make the throttle cable myself, which was pretty sketchy, but I got it done and it seems to work pretty well with good action. Since I have the pods off I can see the slides clearly and I can see that they are all the way down which is what seems odd about this high revving issue. The throttle cable is working well in unison with the slides and I am not detecting that there is any obstruction. I called a guy last night that is somewhat local and he mentioned that the ingition or the timing could be causing this high revving if it is for sure not the carbs. I am certainly no expert, but I do know that the carb slides are all the way down when I am getting this issue.

Also, when I get the bike started it seems to idle okay and as soon as I even feather the throttle it takes off with the high revving. I let go of the throttle and I can see that again the slides are all the way down, but there is nothing left to do but kill it by turning it off. Frustrating little booger!

Any suggestions? I thank you all for the help and advice.
 
pnedac,

Well, perhaps not points themselves, but if the advance mechanism is binding, or the return springs are weak, then the timing may stay advanced even though you have eased off on the throttle.

Here is a video of how the advance should "snap" back to the idle position if the springs are good and there is no binding. Note how the weights return to the completely retracted position and there is a slight bit of daylight in the coils of the springs showing that they have some tension on them and they are not completely slack:

 
I think it might be possible to run into this if your advance plate springs were shot. once you rev, the advance falls all the way forward and... maybe? Just guessing, really.

I would actually expect a stuck advance plate to cause pinging and backfire and then stalling.
 
Would timing issues cause high idol after the motor has been ran for awhile? If I go out and start mine now...it seems to idol fine. If I put a few miles in and stop, it idols high and stays that way. I'm getting ready to order a Pamco setup so I guess I'll find out for sure but just wondering in the mean time.
 
my bet is on sticky advance or the carbs need syncing.


i still run points on mine and it runs like a champ, although next year the new repro exhaust and pamco are on the list.
 
No...never races. I'll just come to a stop and let off the throttle and it will be idling high and doesn't settle down. I can work the carb with my hand and it still does it so I know it's not a sticky cable. I figured it was a carb issue and I cleaned it last week but haven't taken the bike out since so I could be fixed. I have the brakes and shift linkage torn off the bike atm so I can ride until I get those fixed.
 
You may just have your idle speed set too high. These are old bikes and when cold will idle very low, maybe not at all. As they warm up, the idle speed will go up. Set your idle speed to 1200 when the bike is hot. If you set it to 1200 on a cold motor, it will idle too high when warm.
 
Ding Ding Ding we have a winner!!!!! The advance unit on my bike is very sticky and the springs very weak. I think I will have to figure this out now and get this bad boy on the road for real! THANKS TO ALL THE XS650 ADVICE!!!!
 
No bull, as soon as I got home from work I popped the cover off and sure enough they are so weak you can just push them open and they just stay. Dead springs for sure. I just ordered a new set of springs, the rest of the unit looks fine. The motor is actually young for a 77 with only 5,000 original miles so this is a great little find for me. Very glad to have this be the case, dumb as it may sound. What can I say? This is my very first build!
 

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