Thinking of buying this 1981...do you think it's a good deal?

Hi JayR,
while any XS650 is better than no XS650 I cannot understand why Skull likes a '79 above an '81 by a 3 to 1 ratio.
While I'd take a nice clean '79 above a rubbished out '80 or newer that's all about condition; WTF, it's just about the same effin' bike!
Just about the only part that can't be simply swapped between the two is the lift-off seat.
And I like the lift-off seat.

A little research and you would know that the 79 is way different than the 81. In fact check out the ID tread and it explains the Differences.

Liking the 79 over the 81 buy 3 to 1 is putting words in my mouth. I said i would travel 3 times the distance to buy the 79 with 2500 miles , ( Posted in the ebay link ), over the 81 that needs a lot of money spent on it straight away and that was just the obvious.

So WTF, it is my opinion and your welcome to yours. I did explain why the 79 is my preferred Special. Read my post. Do the research.
 
JayR I actually threw those out just to see how deep your interest was.
you already stated in your first post you weren't interested in a builder.
You really should pm xsleo and see if he still has the 81(?) for sale.
I'm pretty sure he is a stand up guy and wouldn't try to pawn off a sows ear as a silk purse. Besides the mentoring you would receive.
Also FYI prices in the early spring are ALWAYS too high. You missed the best time to buy by 3 months. Call it spring fever I guess.

@fredintoon and 650skull. WTF no effin need to trash a thread with personal baggage (as defined #4 in WordWeb or #3 in Merriam-Webster).
 
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@fredintoon and 650skull. WTF no effin need to trash a thread with personal baggage (as defined #4 in WordWeb or #3 in Merriam-Webster).

Actually we if you read my posts i was trying to keep factual information about the headers posted up for the op. Your post was a diagnosis of my observation. Its my last post that is correcting another members false interpretation of my post.

Thanks for pointing this out.
 
A little research and you would know that the 79 is way different than the 81. In fact check out the ID tread and it explains the Differences.
Liking the 79 over the 81 buy 3 to 1 is putting words in my mouth. I said i would travel 3 times the distance to buy the 79 with 2500 miles , ( Posted in the ebay link ), over the 81 that needs a lot of money spent on it straight away and that was just the obvious.
So WTF, it is my opinion and your welcome to yours. I did explain why the 79 is my preferred Special. Read my post. Do the research.

Hi Skull,
travel takes time and time is money so yes you did.
I don't need to do the research because I built the bikes.
Well, I didn't build the '84 Heritage Special because I bought it NOS in '86 but I've owned and tinkered with it ever since.
But I bought the '79 Special as a trailerfull of parts for $100 and sold it for $1,200 after I'd put it back together, made it look nice and got it running again.
And I stand by what I said, apart from some minor differences ('79:- disk rear brake, hinge-up seat, points iggy, '84:- drum rear brake, lift-off seat, transistor iggy) they are essentially the same effin' bike and anything except the seat that you don't like on one you can swap for a part from t'other.
 
I'll start from the rear and go through to the front.

Tail/brake light on the 79 is mounted on the rear of the guard with 4 bolts.
Tail light on the 81 is mounted on the rear of the guard with 3 bolts.
Not interchangeable without visual or structural problems.

Rear grab rail on the 79 can be changed to the 81 but the indicators cannot be mounted on the grab-rail as per the 79 because the 81 frame has an different bracket welded to the frame to carry the indicators and it interferes with the 79 indicator mounts.
81 Grab rail will interchange to a 79 frame but there is no provision on the 79 frame for any indicators ...................Frame change in that area as well.

Rear brake on the 79 is a disk brake rear Mag With a swing arm to match. Different brake stay bracket and hydrolic hose brackets
Rear brake on the 81 is drum brake mag.
Swing arm can be swapped but needs bracket changes and the brake stays are not interchangeable.

Master cylinder from the 79 cannot be interchanged with the 81 No brackets or mounts.
Brake actuator is completely different and will not interchange either.

Seats are different. 79 is hinged and 81 is a clip on. Will not interchange.

Carburetors on the 79 are BS38's and BS34's on the 81. Carbs can be changed but the boots have to be changed as well. Because the width of the carbs and boots are different between the 2 different carb sets, the air-box would need to be changed as well.
Air boxes are not interchangeable because they have different mounting points.
Carbs cannot be interchanged from the 79 to the 81 or vice versa.

79 and 81 looms do not interchange.
to do so the Stator/rotor and coils need to be changed as well. Coil mounts are different. 79 has 2 mounts 81 has 1 mount

79 loom has a built in alternator fail warning system built into the loom that is linked to the brake fail light.

79 side-covers are metal attached by lugs and a latch.
81 side covers are plastic and are attached by push on grommets.
Not interchangeable

Gauges are interchangeable but the neutral indicator light is mounted in the rev counter on the 79 and on the light tower on the 81.
Again they can be interchanged but wiring changes would need to be made if some parts are swapped. Would be without a neutral light if the tower only from a 79 was swapped to an 81

Although all of these problems can be overcome an 81 would swap to a Standard, 77-79, frame easier than to a 78/79 Special frame.

There are a couple of more things like the Rectifier and regulator and ignition. but i'll leave it at that.
 
JayR I actually threw those out just to see how deep your interest was.
you already stated in your first post you weren't interested in a builder.
You really should pm xsleo and see if he still has the 81(?) for sale.
I'm pretty sure he is a stand up guy and wouldn't try to pawn off a sows ear as a silk purse. Besides the mentoring you would receive).

Thanks weekend rider I'll look him up. I may have seen his listing if I recall correctly he is in Buffalo NY and I was concerned about the logistics of getting the bike if it was the right one (8 hrs one way).

YES - I started looking in January and found 2 bikes within a 2 hour drive that were great. One for $1500 and the other for $2000. On hindsight I'd buy either in a minute now, but I didn't know the market so I was like, meh, let me look around. Doh! :banghead:

And yeah I am looking primarily for a bike in decent shape to tinker with but the reason I became interested in the 650 to begin with was because of the great builds out there and the work of dudes like Machi. So an affordable beater like New London always brings me back to that original ambition.
 
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I'll start from the rear and go through to the front. - - - - - There are a couple of more things like the Rectifier and regulator and ignition. but I'll leave it at that.

Hi Skull,
you are absolutely correct, there's a whole slew of detail changes between a '79 Special and an '81 Special.
What remains beyond my comprehension is your insistence that the '79 is a much better bike.
What I reckon is the better bike to have is the one that's in better shape.
 
JayR, 17 hours to go and still 3,000.

looks like the buyer is sitting and waiting.

As a buyer i always look for a lie or evasive answers. If a seller is caught out then my spidery sense is awoken and once it is i am more than ready to walk away and wait for another opportunity. Yes they always do come about again, just takes time and patience.

Why would i buy the 79, (in the ebay add), over the 81, (first post).

The 79 at 2,600 miles, has hardly been broken in, it is in concourse condition and it shows in the small things. The stencils on the instrument tower has no fading at all. With such low miles there is little chance any damage, of any kind, through any lack of maintenance. Pics are notoriously hard to gauge the condition of any bike because they will always show it to be better than it really is.
The pics of the 79 shows absolutely no rust in the usual spots, around the carb area or bolts or nuts where a wrench has been used at some time or another. The chrome appears to have a good deep luster., and the rear wheel shows where the chain has thrown some lube against the alloy on the back wheel. Shows the bike in a used condition. Really does looks like it is just off the showroom floor.

These are all positives but the secret now would be to ask some questions of a general nature about its history and if any work or upgrades have been done to it and if yes to any then ask what and why.

If i ask 3 questions, (never ask to many for a start 3 is enough), in a query and the seller only addresses 2 my sense's start to tingle, just one then i am in a very defensive mode. Every question deserves an answer, i will usually address the question, (with others), again and if it is unanswered again i walk. There is no excuse for a seller not to answer a question, maybe it is missed that's why i would give them the opportunity to answer again in another batch of questions. A dodgy seller will think he is getting away with something if the same question is posted with others again and he/she doesn't answer the repeated question.

The 81, 6000+ miles.

The headers are a big concern for me. The discoloring of the headers, and especially different colors, raise a lot of other questions about the condition of the motor. If the maintenance is so laxed on the carbs, (causing the heat stains on the pipe), then has the maintenance schedule been keep up in other areas and even if it has to what quality has the work been done. Cam chain especially and tappets comes to mind. As Weekendrider pointed out the carbs have been overflowing, so what has caused this and is the issue resolved, or as it looks like, the bike has been ridden with one side rich and the other lean. There is a chance damage has been done to the internals. I have seen neglected Specials with oxidization/rust on the headers and the inner is still good.
The rest of the bike looks to be in good condition, but with the headers like that i would be inclined to disbelieve the speedo, and look for any telltale signs of a change.

To sum up the 81:
Obvious damage and tell tale signs of past/ongoing problems that could have major implications, internally, (top end), and cost a lot of money in the immediate and near future.............Note: signs are there but the worse case scenario is still ...........could be............. Would need a comprehensive pre buy check to confirm one way or anothe,r the problems listed above.

To sum up the 79:
All indications are of a well looked after low mileage bike in excellent condition. No indications of any neglect or abuse...........Note: Needs to be heard running, as a pre buy check test the rotor for charging issues and that all electrics are working. If it was running a compression test wouldn't hurt.

I would travel 3 times the distance, (would i travel 3000 miles to 1000 miles, proberbly not, but i would travel 300 miles to 100 miles, Yes, probably even 600 to 200 or 1000 to 333), to buy the 79 over the 81 based on the points above.

I know the 81 has been sold but the comparisons can relate to any further bikes you may look at.

Hope this helps you in the future, JayR.
 
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Since it seems you just plan on cutting the fucker up, buy the cheapest, most beat up Special you can find. Under no circumstances should you buy that nice '77 Standard. That is one of the most sought after models out there and it would be a real shame to see it fall into the hands of a Sawzall monkey.
 
- - - I would travel 3 times the distance, (would i travel 3000 miles to 1000 miles, proberbly not, but i would travel 300 miles to 100 miles, Yes, probably even 600 to 200 or 1000 to 333), to buy the 79 over the 81 based on the points above. - - -

Hi Skull,
silly me, I understood you to mean that any '79 was inherently more desirable than any '81.
Carefully re-reading this string I now understand that what you meant was that particular '79 was a far better buy than that particular '81.
So after all the discussions, we are in agreement.
And JayL, what 5twins said but in softer terms, if you are going to cut it up, don't buy a good rideable bike, buy one that needs saving from the breaker's yard.
A bike club newbie had been conned by fellow members who knew of my extreme negative opinion regarding hardtailing into showing me photos of his recently hardtailed XS650. We then had this discussion:-
Me:- Why you do that, you f**king Vandal?
Him:- It had been backed over by a truck. I didn't have the money to replace the crushed frame, swingarm and back wheel. What I did have was some steel tube, a TIG welder and a back wheel from a Harley.
Me:- What a nice bike!
 
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caution - thread diversion: fredintoon I see that you are a man of erudition since you capitalized the "v"
 
Hey JayR, look around like weekendrider said. got this 1983 xs650 Heritage special for $500.00
 

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JayR, 17 hours to go and still 3,000.

looks like the buyer is sitting and waiting.



Hope this helps you in the future, JayR.

Skull it sold for 3050 - if I were in TX perhaps would have bought, couldn't rationalize the $900 shipping. Bike buying is really a local ordeal I suppose. And thanks for the suggestions on how to have a keen eye when assessing - taking it all in from you guys.
 
Since it seems you just plan on cutting the fucker up, buy the cheapest, most beat up Special you can find. Under no circumstances should you buy that nice '77 Standard. That is one of the most sought after models out there and it would be a real shame to see it fall into the hands of a Sawzall monkey.

Mercy no, the 1977 is a specimen of the 650 at the pinnacle. My earlier posts mention my preference for a respectable stocker to improve upon here and there for fun since time demands don't make a build realistic. That said, I do have a sawzall and a natural inclination for destruction, so if the right beater comes along all bets are off.:bike:
 
Hi Skull,

And JayL, what 5twins said but in softer terms, if you are going to cut it up, don't buy a good rideable bike, buy one that needs saving from the breaker's yard.

Me:- Why you do that, you f**king Vandal?
Him:- It had been backed over by a truck. I didn't have the money to replace the crushed frame, swingarm and back wheel. What I did have was some steel tube, a TIG welder and a back wheel from a Harley.
Me:- What a nice bike!

Roger that Fredintoon and 5twins re: beaters.

Fredintoon that's effen funny:laugh:
 
So fellas, if the 1977 is the poster boy for leaving a bike alone, this 1983 is it's counterpoint. Owner says it is in good running condition, 10,000 miles, but he is working on 4 other bikes so needs to sell this one. Asking price......$1,750! :laugh: spray painted engine, tank, pods with who knows what jetting, umm some sort of headers he was describing as desirable.

I emailed him a month ago when first posted on CL, and respectfully provided my POV that perhaps it is worth $500 (Richard!).

He replied quite confidently that he had receive multiple emails, and he would get his price. So, 4 weeks later.....here she still is.

That said, I could be tempted to abandon my stock ambitions if something like this was rideable - and then bang away on it.
 

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- - - Fredintoon that's effen funny:laugh:

Hi JayR,
glad I could spread a laugh but I swear it's also effin' true.
And now my son Eric's caught the hardtail bug. Plus it's my fault.
Well, actually it's Daryl's fault because Daryl's the one who found a derelict XS650
at a local scrapyard and told me about it so I bought it at 12cents a pound and
gave it to Eric to see what parts he could rob off it for his '80 Special.
Good news & bad news sez Eric.
The motor looks like it'll run and the forks are straight but the rear frame is FUBAR.
Then we will get it running and look for a better frame, sez I.
Nah, sez Eric, I'll turn it into a hardtail, like that guy you told me about.
 
Hi JayR,
here's a Canadian '80 for you to consider:-

Im selling my restored stock 1980 XS650, Motor is stock bore with new cam chain and follower, bead blasted and rebuilt with new seals and gaskets. Frame is powder coated with new steering head bearings and bronze swing arm bushings.A ton of new parts including wiring loom, reg/rect, Commando style silencers, air filters, mirrors, handlebars, brake pads and shoes, forks rebuilt with new seals .All alloy parts polished and chrome is in great shape.Colour is black. Starts and runs perfectly ,needs nothing to certify. Asking $2900 obo .
Call me and I ll email pics 705 888 0123 mick

This ad in the CVMG on-line magazine "for sale" section.
Seller is Mick Vaclavic and the 705 area code sez mid-Ontario.
And the price is in 92cent Canadian dollars.
 
:DWell I thought I'd check back in. You've all been very helpful and I found a 1982 XS 650 For $900. No that is not the original tank. Brought it home today in a rented Home Depot van. It was close by and will allow me to do "that build" someday without hacking up a nice stock bike. The PO bought it from a PO who had taken it apart. The guy I bought it from slapped the parts back together and if my plan was to keep it stock I'd have a lot to do just with then nuts and bolts.

But since I'm going to strip it down to the frame, the plan at least now is to address the electrical (new harness, etc), carbs (it only runs with the choke on because of the pods), and brakes when I build back up. The one thing Id like to do before stripping it though it to get the carbs working halfway decently. That way I can do a proper compression test before disassembly and determine if any engine work is in order etc.....woo hoo!!:thumbsup::bike: now the real fun starts?
 

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