1976 XS650 restoration and rebuild, advice and help welcomed!

[robinc]

What's the real conundrum for me is that it ran yesterday and now won't start again. If you haven't changed anything other than headlight wire this is a puzzle as to why you don't have spark.

Did you check fuse (fuses)? My 77 and 78 only have 1 - 20 amp fuse, I would guess yours is the same, but don't know for sure.

I haven't looked at the wiring diagrams, but try switching that wire back to the way it was and see if you have spark again. Worth a shot and may be indicative of the fact that there are more issues that need to be sorted in the old H/L bucket. If it will start again, you'll answer that question.

 

[MaxPete]

OK - well, somebody has to ask you George....

..is the "KILL" switch in the centre - run - position?

A lot of time has been spent troubleshooting bikes....only to find that the kill switch has inadvertently been nudged over to one side or the other.

 

[robinc]

Sorry George, just reread your post #336.

Fuses are OK...good.
You say you're not sure if you have spark. Don't know how you're testing for this.

Pull a spark plug, connect the spark plug wire and ground the plug threads to the cylinder cooling fins. To do this, hold the plug threads on the fins with a clamp of some sort so it won't fall off. Darkness now helps here. Total darkness not necessary, but bright sunlight is not your friend right now.

Turn the bike over and you should see a nice blue spark jump across the spark plug electrodes. If you see this, you have spark and your problem lies elsewhere. If no spark, you have now narrowed things down.

 

[fredintoon]

OK - well, somebody has to ask you George....
..is the "KILL" switch in the centre - run - position?
A lot of time has been spent troubleshooting bikes....only to find that the kill switch has been nudged over to one side or the other.

Hi Pete,
Oh my, YES!
When has ANYONE, EVER, used that EPA-mandated pest of a thing for it's proper purpose?
Damn few I reckon. But it's been accidentally tripped a fair number of times and I remember one time
kicking my guts out for 10 minutes before I noticed that some helpful person had tripped mine.
So yes George, check your killswitch position.

 

[MaxPete]

....errrr...ummmmm....yeah....been there too Fred. I did EXACTLY that on my '75 650, my '79 GS850 (that was the only year with a kick starter) and more recently on dear old Lucille. In fact, on the '75, I kicked so vigorously that I actually fell right over.

Kill switches...gotta love 'em....but precisely what (or whom) are they intended to kill?

ALSO - sorry, but I ran out of steam and didn't get the Lucille headlight bucket job done. Hopefully, tomorrow.

Pete

 

[robinc]

Kill switches...gotta love 'em....but precisely what are they intended to kill?

The user I figure.

 

[robinc]

Hey George, another question if your Kill switch is set to Run and before you start chasing electrical gremlins.

Are your petcocks turned on? You may have just burned the gas that was in the float bowls and she's done run dry.

 

[YamadudeXS650C]

Video Guru Chat, I love it!
" It appears to be the wiring in your headlight bucket"

View attachment 100738

I haven't seen Max Headroom in years and years. Thanks for the m..m...m...m..memory, Mailman

 

[Mailman]

I haven't seen Max Headroom in years and years. Thanks for the m..m...m...m..memory, Mailman

Hahaha! I thought that might just sail right over most peoples heads. Especially those not in the U.S.

 

[fredintoon]

I haven't seen Max Headroom in years and years. Thanks for the m..m...m...m..memory, Mailman

Me too 'Dude,
alas, like any show that was more interesting than the commercials, it didn't last for very long.

 

[MaxPete]

Indeed

 

[GeorgeOC]

Quick update... After some consternation, and fiddling I was able find the elusive spark. But only temporarily. I was able to get the bike to fire up again while jumped from the car battery. Overnight the Shorai lithium ion battery was on the tender in recovery mode. Fast forward 24hrs later. The Shorai battery registered a full charge, and I tossed it back in the bike to attempt another test. No luck, and no spark. Pulled the plugs, and removed the Shorai Li-ion battery in favor of jumpering from the car again. I do have spark. But after refitting the plugs, she still wouldn't fire up.

If she 'ran' for a little initially, and if there's spark now still, (regardless of source at this time), this leads my to think I may have a carb/fuel issue? *choke was on for test, and kill switch on 'run.'...

 

[MaxPete]

OK - this is pretty weird. It sounds like the only time the bike has run is when you have it connected to a car battery.

Can you get your money back on that battery?

 

[GeorgeOC]

Thanks Pete, I should be able to if needed. The bike ran with the Shorai battery initially. But then stopped when I had the headlight drain. I got it restarted briefly yesterday with the car, yes. Tonight I will triple verify the Shorai ability to deliver spark...

 

[TimeMachine]

carb/fuel issue, You think ? Very easy to drain carb bowls and test petcocks . Hope for you its a fuel issue (easy) . Electrical issues just annoy me so much I wanna use a tazer on my bike ! Hang in there George

 

[TimeMachine]

Curious, does anybody ever recommend removing the air filters and trying starting fluid ? I have not done this with XS Mikunis but really does work on utility engines.. anybody ?

 

[Mailman]

Had the plugs pulled to see if I had spark... Nothing.

George, I know others have brought this up, about making sure your spark plug is properly grounded when you are checking for spark. I know that Pamco has very specific warnings about that. I was just wondering, the first time you were checking for spark, did you have your spark plug grounded as recommended? I guess what I'm getting at is , is there a possibility you didn't ground the plugs when you had them out checking your spark and maybe damaged your ignition? Just throwing out the idea. Pamco has procedures for checking ignition components on his website.
Good luck, Bob

 

[gggGary]

I'm guilty of a shot of starting fluid now and then but mostly on motors without carbs, to "hear em run" before pulling out the money gun on rehab projects. I like the visual inline spark testers.

 

[GeorgeOC]

What's the real conundrum for me is that it ran yesterday and now won't start again. If you haven't changed anything other than headlight wire this is a puzzle as to why you don't have spark.

Did you check fuse (fuses)? My 77 and 78 only have 1 - 20 amp fuse, I would guess yours is the same, but don't know for sure.

I haven't looked at the wiring diagrams, but try switching that wire back to the way it was and see if you have spark again. Worth a shot and may be indicative of the fact that there are more issues that need to be sorted in the old H/L bucket. If it will start again, you'll answer that question.

Fuses checked, thanks @robinc . I am running a 15a for the main, and a 7.5 in the e-advance circuit. There seems to be some miss matches in the wiring diagrams in the strength of the main fuse. 15a or 20a. Not sure which is correct! Maybe I ought to try a 20a and see what happens!

 

[GeorgeOC]

George, I know others have brought this up, about making sure your spark plug is properly grounded when you are checking for spark. I know that Pamco has very specific warnings about that. I was just wondering, the first time you were checking for spark, did you have your spark plug grounded as recommended? I guess what I'm getting at is , is there a possibility you didn't ground the plugs when you had them out checking your spark and maybe damaged your ignition? Just throwing out the idea. Pamco has procedures for checking ignition components on his website.
Good luck, Bob

Thanks Mailman, you bet that's a concern. If by grounding the plugs, you mean making sure they are touching the cylinder head, then yes. The good news now, is that I just tested for spark again using the Shorai battery. I had spark on both left and right plug. Giddy as a school girl, I set them back into the head. Choke on, Kill at 'run,' petcocks open, ignition position 1. And son of a gun, wouldn't turn over.

So, good news... at least there is spark.