Damn Insurance Companies rule the world!

[TwoManyXS1Bs]

I have medicare, but can't use it.

Need a doctor that'll accept me, and medicare.

Keep striking out.

Money going into a black hole, by federal decree...

 

[grizld1]

Yeah, Gary, Medicare chops the charges. A lot of pure waste is included in those charges, though. The big fad in hospitals in my area is "patient satisfaction." It's been pushed to the point in one local hospital that if some 400 pound bariatric case asks for a Big Mac, nursing has to send somebody down to the on-site McD's (!) and fetch it. If something like that had been proposed by a hospital administrator in the old days, the Chief of Staff would have responded thus: "We are not here to satisfy patients. Our business is to treat them. I think we'd do better with a manager who understands the difference. Go clean out your desk, you're done." I could list many more costly administrative absurdities. If hospitals want to bring costs in line with Medicare compensation, they can cut many cords of dead wood (almost all of it's found in the top of the tree).

 

[retiredgentleman]

I advocate a system of survival based on knowledge and situational awareness. Can't stop a freight train by standing in the tracks, arms outstretched in a "halt" gesture. Gotta figure out how this works.

Like Mailman, I too had a serious life challenge 18 years ago. Working in the corporate environment, signed on for the insurance options.

Then, it hit. Diagnosed with stage 3 cancer, pretty bad. Doctors/hospital conferred with my medical insurance reps. Yep, pretty bad, lets just make him comfortable.

Paperwork shuffling, notifications to various parties, preparations for hospice, perhaps later when the symptoms become intolerable.

Suddenly there was a panicky flurry of activity. Seems that my life insurance folks got wind of this, and weren't going to sit by and watch a $1 million claim spill out.

I was hospitalized the next day...

2M ......................that's great that you made a recovery from Cancer! So did your insurance cover all the costs, or did you have to pay a large amount yourself?

 

[retiredgentleman]

How does quality change in a single payer system? I doubt you get the best money can buy out of it.

Canada's health system is not the best in the world. We are more in the middle of the pack. Tops is that would be Japan, UK, Switzerland and others. Our biggest feature is that we provide for care for everyone, without asking if they have money.
The USA spends twice as much money per capita, compared to Canada, and yet has poorer health care.
This is an article from 2014. The USA ranks very low.

"The World Health Organization ranked American health care 37th in the world,and in a recent comprehensive, comparative study, the Commonwealth Fund ranked America’s health care system last on the basis of 21 indicative factors. Analyzing the countries that have surpassed the U.S. in these rankings highlights a puzzling reality: What places these other countries ahead of the U.S. is not just their universal health care systems, but also their significantly lower health care costs and undeniably greater efficiency and equity."

 

[TwoManyXS1Bs]

RG, my insurance covered everything, except for the occasional $5 copay.
Did a rudimentary total of all the billing, about 1/4 million $, at their reduced rate. Mind boggling to think of what it would've been at normal rates...

 

[geedubya]

Grizld1 said,
“My doctor tried to give me a scrip for Symbacort as a preventive measure to slow down development of COPD. I refused it because I don't have trouble breathing, don't think inhaling a corticosteroid is a good idea unless there's a serious respiratory problem,”

I quite agree, believe me I was not crazy about the idea. I’m no doctor, but the way my doctor explained it to me was that un checked asthma continually damages lung tissue. Without preventative care, the long term damage becomes irreversible and life changing.

RetiredGentleman said,
“ What is affordable to you may not be to others.”

This is so true, my next door neighbor had a specific type of cancer that the treatment required weekly shots that were thousands of dollars each. He did it a few times and realized he was only going to bankrupt his wife. So he stopped and quietly died.

My father died of COPD, the last few years he could not afford the medications the doctor prescribed so he would pick and choose what he could afford. It broke my heart and forever changed the way I look at our healthcare system.

Bob,

That is so sad that people have to die because their family will suffer.

Shame on the USA
Come on Bob move to Oz where you can at least die assisted by the government (sic)

 

[Bob Kelly III]

With the "so called health care" system in the US if I find out I have some long term medical problem that would bankrupt me I might just decide to buy a High horse power sport bike and see how fast it will go and leave my mark on the next bridge abutment!

Oh and yes I would buy that sport bike on time with low down payment and insurance to cover the payments!

funny to see that someone else has had the same idea of beating the system..... however If I did that and I have it all planned and the bridge abutment all picked out.... , I would leave my wife without my income.... which would mean she would loose the house
and be homeless.... the same goes for her if she goes first.... I'ed loose the house.... so we can't win !
I still cannot figure out how SSI can pay me only $596. a month and expect me to live I can barely buy food for the 3 of us for the month with that ... yet alone a $777 house payment......
oh well.... such is the way of it....
that's how it goes, first your money.... then your clothes !
....
lol
Bob.......

 

[gggGary]

Kinda sad or funny but I know a long straight bridge, at the far end the road T's at a rock wall......
It's been used before.

 

[nj1639]

"Damn the concept of personal responsibility. Full speed ahead!"

"If I had known that I'd have lived this long I'd have done things differently."

"Sometimes Grandma is just gonna have to take the pill."

A benevolent fiduciary or a tyrannical monster?

 

[xjwmx]

True.
But, the appeal is directed towards the keepers.

What I hear in my head is:
"I have a right to your services, efforts, and sweat".

I got that. I believe we have natural rights that include life and liberty. We're assured of having a lawyer to protect our liberty.

 

[ThatXS650Guy]

I got that. I believe we have natural rights that include life and liberty. We're assured of having a lawyer to protect our liberty.

But only if you cannot afford one and you are not forced to use the Public Defender.
A system that depends on force and not free choice is a threat to Liberty.

 

[grizld1]

Debating who has a "right" to health care is beside the point. We have highways and bridges owned and maintained by the public (and that's us, not them if we're doing what we should be doing as citizens) because relying on private toll roads and private toll bridges didn't work out. Some things are better done individually, some things are better done collectively, and some things are better done in combination. When it comes to a question of rights, I'm unwilling to concede the right to bleed the American public white to a pack of bloodsucking MBAs. And that, friends, is where too many of your health care dollars go.

 

[nj1639]

" From each, according to their ability, to each according to their need"
15 million in the 20th century were either unable or too needy..... the ultimate results of Tiberius and Gaius political policy.

"All I want in life is loose shoes, tight p@$$y and a warm place to take a dump."

 

[Bob Kelly III]

xjwmx: no your not ! they cost MONEY... big money at that ! your only assured you have a lawyer if you can afford one ...I certainly can't !
the court will appoint one if you can't afford one.... but that would be a 2nd rait lawyer that is so used to loosing that he really doesn't care any more..... so how is that fair ?
we do have natural Rights ! and that I truly do believe... but they are squashed by the powers that be at every turn !
but one thing for sure gripeing about it doesn't help a thing.....
batten down the hatches boys , it get rougher as you go along ! there is no way out except that long bridge and rock wall at the end that I know of..... if I were Rich however... well that's another story completely.... its not so bad when you can do anything you want and afford anything you need.... including insurance out the kazoo....
Insurance is a Gamble.... on the issuers side and your side as well.... with all the information they have amassed over the years do you really think their going to loose that gamble ? I think not.
....
I'll shutup now <grin>
Bob.........

 

[retiredgentleman]

Debating who has a "right" to health care is beside the point. We have highways and bridges owned and maintained by the public (and that's us, not them if we're doing what we should be doing as citizens) because relying on private toll roads and private toll bridges didn't work out. Some things are better done individually, some things are better done collectively, and some things are better done in combination. When it comes to a question of rights, I'm unwilling to concede the right to bleed the American public white to a pack of bloodsucking MBAs. And that, friends, is where too many of your health care dollars go.

Yes about 50% of the health care money spent in the USA, is skimmed away by the large "heath care" companies.
No large companies skimming profits here! In Canada, its the law. Everyone has the "right" to quality health care. If a minimum wage worker at Walmart making $20,000/year, or a lawyer making $500,000/year need a heart by-pass operation, they will both receive the same high quality operation.

 

[xjwmx]

But only if you cannot afford one and you are not forced to use the Public Defender.
A system that depends on force and not free choice is a threat to Liberty.

Using the legal system as a model, you're guaranteed a defense that meets the minimum of some board. Still, if you're able, you can hire F. Lee Bailey along with Dr. Bull to rig the jury...

 

[Mailman]

No one expects free healthcare. As Fred has said a couple of times a single payer system is paid for by all of us paying higher taxes in exchange for a government provided healthcare system. The biggest benefit of that is that when an entire country is negotiating costs as a single block there is bargaining power. That’s why prescription meds are so less expensive in Canada. No one system is perfect, as previously stated, sometimes there is less choice in a single payer system or an extended wait time for non emergency care.
Everyone sees the world from their own unique perspective, everyone has their own ideas of the role that government should or should not play in their lives. When I started this thread I just wanted to bitch about my insurance company denying me a preferred medication. I had no idea the hornets nest that I was kicking. The very last thing I ever wanted to do was incite any arguments or cause any hard feelings. So for me, I’m outa here and back to bikes! Later!
Bob

 

[fredintoon]

No large companies skimming profits here! In Canada, its the law. Everyone has the "right" to quality health care. If a minimum wage worker at Walmart making $20,000/year, or a lawyer making $500,000/year need a heart by-pass operation, they will both receive the same high quality operation.

Hi RG,
true, no corporate skimming here.
Instead, our health system has far too many middle & upper management backsides polishing office chairs and far too few Babas with scrub-brushes keeping the hospital buildings clean.
And while rich and poor alike have equal rights to medical procedures, only the wealthy can afford to become a medical tourist and jump the line-up.
Although come to think of it, as medical tourism shortens the at home waiting list, perhaps it's a good thing?

 

[retiredgentleman]

Yes Fred, in any country in the world, if you have money, you can go to the head of the queue. The rich people always get the best health care and the fastest health care. That is a good thing, because it opens up space for us commoners to get our operation.
I hope the wealthy Canadians continue to fly off to far away countries, to seek a quick medical solution.

My neighbour had a friend that got news from his doctor here in Canada, that he has cancer and only 6 months to live. His friend was quite wealthy, and immediately planned a trip to Hong Kong to see a high priced cancer specialist. Well, he went there and the Chinese doctor ran some tests, and told him, "yes you have about 6 months to live".

 

[retiredgentleman]

Mailman.........................this is not a hornets nest. I haven't seen any arguments. This has been a very good debate in which everyone gets to state their opinion. This is free speech at its best, and I for one thank you for starting the debate.