WIRE SIZE

[member3480]

OK not going to point fingers YET but I have been buying wire from 4 different vendors for my harnesses. Yesterday I got wire in that was not what I normally get and I spend much money with this vendor. After many calls and text back and forth he tells me that the wire that I was buying is no longer used or he can't get... but I just got it from the other vendor and also went to AUTO ZONE and they also had it??????
So now the investigation is on..... Does anyone have or know in mm what the sizes are from 12 gauge to 18 gauge... The wire I was using is 2.3 mm and the new is 3.3mm
Also I have been in electronic a long time and I never heard of oversize 16 gauge and under sized 16 gauge??? Me I thought it went by the amount of strands and not the jacket. Good thing I have plenty of wire to finish my work.
ANY Help would be great. I am not the only one on here buying from this vendor.
LOOK at picture smaller is 16 gauge and matches what I bought from AUTO ZONE and other vendor

 

[TwoManyXS1Bs]

Hey, Rich. I generally use AWG (American Wire Gauge) charts like this.

The listed wire gauge diameters are for the copper conductor, not the insulation. This chart is for solid conductor, but stranded is quite close.

The insulation thickness is a variable, depending on the specs for materials, dialectric strength, fire resistance, ...etc.

Edit: Trimmed the chart for AWG 12-18

 

[member3480]

Thanks TWOMANY
It tells me just what I was telling this guy that its 12 gauge 3.3
I had them on the phone and used my caliber and that's what I came up with
I think people think everyone is stupid. I am copy this and sending it to them with a piece of wire. I just bought last night from all 4 vendors 16 gauge . Now lets see what I get?

 

[member3480]

Now they sent me overnight what they call 18 gauge
Look at wires and see what you think.
GREEN is there new upgraded 16 gauge (too fat for harness)
YELLOW is what I got from them 2 weeks ago 16 gauge
RED AUTO ZONE 16 gauge
RED Advance Auto 16 gauge
WHITE this is what they over night to me 18 gauge
BROWN from stock XS650 harness
Either I been ripped off by 4 company's HAHA on 16 gauge or
this new fat 16 gauge is all I can get from this vendor.

 

[TwoManyXS1Bs]

Rich, use your calipers and measure the diameters of the conductors. It's best to measure where the conductor just emerges from the insulation, as it'll still be round(ish) there. Then, compare to the chart.

I noticed that our local Autozone is stocking a lot of 14 gauge, with thick insulation. It looks a lot like 12 gauge because of that thicker insulation. The way copper prices have been going up, I would expect some funny business going on in some places.

Edit: Since you're working with stranded wire, use this chart instead.

 

[member3480]

I just want what I paid for HAHA
If I pay for 16 gauge I want 16 gauge NOT 18 gauge and you are calling it 16 gauge.
I ordered from my two other vendors too. So in a couple days I will have 16 gauge from them too and if its what I was buying then I will just stick with that. Just felt like I was getting a song and dance routine from them. They did send me a bunch of new wire on them 18 gauge so now I got to put that away . So they are trying to help me out lol

 

[TwoManyXS1Bs]

Yeah, this rabbit hole can get pretty deep. With stranded wire, the diameter of the conductor can be about 0.010" larger than the equivalent solid wire, and this is confusing. You buy crimp-type connectors sized for a certain gauge, then find that they're a bit too tight for the stranded wires.

The wire gauging used in the electronics industry calls out standards for total cross-sectional area, known as circular-mils, to support specific current ratings.

But, the wire gauging in the mechanical world is looking at the physical conductor diameter to be able to fit conductors into connectors.

I'm suspecting that the auto supply wires were gauged by the solid-core diameters, and what you may have been buying all these years as 16 gauge, due to physical diameter, may have actually been 18 guage stranded, since its physical diameter is close to 16 gauge solid.

Maybe this chart will help.

 

[member3480]

Very cool info. You are sure right on the different size and vendors. I am just going to have to test the wire every time I get it. XS650 doesn't draw that much but other bikes I make harnesses for do. When I do the double battery setup for the Hayabusa the draw is much higher and now I am going to upgrade those kits to a 14 gauge which may be 16 gauge in real life. So you are right I may have been getting 18 gauge all the time and its marked as 16 gauge.
I just don't like the poor look of heavy wire. So I will use what they sent on my car. LOL
I guess I am anal to care about stupid wire but I like to get what I pay for to be correct.
I burned up 22 switches to find the right one for turn signals and found that so many were junk so I will go back to my other vendors and buy the wire I tested and used for years. You try to make things easy and buy closer and it BITES YOU in THE ASS.
TWOMNY need some wire now I got a garage full HAHA
THANKYOU very much for the charts . I copied them and they are hanging in my garage.
Rich

 

[TwoManyXS1Bs]

Glad to be of help, Rich. Just be glad you're not wiring aircraft, with long runs and voltage drops, requiring funky calculations. And, their FAA-approved insulators are all white! Gotta have special labelling tools to keep track of it all.

Handy tip for ya: For every 3-count drop in gauge number, the circular mils doubles, and the current carrying capacity doubles. For example, dropping 6 counts from 18ga to 12ga, increases circular mils from 1600 to 6400, a four-fold increase.

Good luck with your wire suppliers...

 

[TwoManyXS1Bs]

I bought some red multistrand 14-gauge wire at our local Autozone.
The conductor diameter is about 0.061"-0.062", which is actually 16-gauge.
True 14-gauge multistrand would be close to 0.075".

Go figure...

 

[member3480]

SEE I HAD YOU THINKING HAHA
I am not the only crazy one that looks at something and says that's not right LOL
I tested 4 wires on SATURDAY and they took 24 volts with two motorcycle batteries which is not big amps maybe 250. But I also used two car batteries that each had 180 amps and use motorcycle starter as my load and they got hot but NO damage and I spun the starter a good bit and did on/off shots . So I felt a little better. My neighbor came in garage he's a Harley guy and was laughing at me.... Had to know that these wires are as good as vendor says.
I just can't use the big wire they sent which they say is TRUE 16 GAUGE . Too big for a clean harness on a bike but could use on my car projects. SO NOW ITS TIME TO MAKE SOME HARNESSES I have plenty of wire LOL