mm1ut1
XS650 Addict
Their products seem to be hit or miss so I am wondering if anyone has an opinion on them. I will use them mainly to chase down threads and clean out bolt holes.
-
Enjoy XS650.com? Consider making a donation to help support the site.
XS650.com receives a small share of sales from some links on this page, but direct donations have a much greater impact on keeping this site going.
Harbor Freight tap and die set
- Thread starter mm1ut1
- Start date
I live in Canada and here we have Princess Automotive which is very similar to Harbour Fright but with slightly lower Chinesium content. I have also bought a fair bit of stuff at Horrible Fright - but don't - for God's sake, tell my wife.
I don't think that I have never had anything from either place outright fail - but I am pretty selective about what I buy and I observe certain guidelines / rules which have been confirmed on numerous other sites - including the Project Farm site on YouTube which is absolutely excellent. I never buy anything tool or shop-related without checking Project Farm and about 80% of the time, he has done a test on exactly that item.
In general, Chinese metallurgy is often not that good (hence the rule on cutting tools below) and while nearly all batteries are made in Asia - each factory has definite product "lines" ranging from really good (i.e. Milwaukee and usually DeWalt) to pretty crappy (these would be used in their house brands like Bauer etc.)
Here are my "rules" for Harbour Freight and Princess Auto:
1) NEVER buy anything that is rechargable (the el-cheapo batteries never seem to stand-up in tests);
2) only buy corded power tools if you can plug them in at the store and see no smoke - and only if on sale;
3) only buy cutting type tools such as drill bits, saw blades, scrapers, etc. if they are on sale and can be viewed as disposable;
4) "dumb" stuff like hammers, punches, and non-powered tools like large wrenches and sockets, screwdrivers, vises and arbour presses are fine;
5) shop equipment such as toolboxes, storage bins etc. are usually OK - but inspect them before leaving the store as many items seem to get dinged-up in transit from whereevertheheck they are made;
6) any brand name tools like Channel-Lock pliers are fine (and at Princess Auto, these often go on sale);
7) disposable / consumable items like shop rags, masks, goggles, electrical wire and wiring connectors, etc. are also OK.
Having said that, I have a tap and die set that I bought at Canadian Tire (think Pep Boys combined with Ace Hardware and bit of Home Despot) about 50 years ago - and they are still going strong - although some common size taps (like 1/4-20 UNC and M6 and M8, etc.) have been replaced over the years because I broke them or they wore out.
Soooooo....based on all of that, I think, I'd hold out for a Dormer or other name-brand set of taps and dies - unless all you are going to do is chase-out threads etc. In that case, they may be just fine!
Pete
PS - check out the Project Farm channel on YouTube - it really is excellent. I have told the host that most of his videos would be worthy of a Masters degree in engineering - they are that well-done.
I don't think that I have never had anything from either place outright fail - but I am pretty selective about what I buy and I observe certain guidelines / rules which have been confirmed on numerous other sites - including the Project Farm site on YouTube which is absolutely excellent. I never buy anything tool or shop-related without checking Project Farm and about 80% of the time, he has done a test on exactly that item.
In general, Chinese metallurgy is often not that good (hence the rule on cutting tools below) and while nearly all batteries are made in Asia - each factory has definite product "lines" ranging from really good (i.e. Milwaukee and usually DeWalt) to pretty crappy (these would be used in their house brands like Bauer etc.)
Here are my "rules" for Harbour Freight and Princess Auto:
1) NEVER buy anything that is rechargable (the el-cheapo batteries never seem to stand-up in tests);
2) only buy corded power tools if you can plug them in at the store and see no smoke - and only if on sale;
3) only buy cutting type tools such as drill bits, saw blades, scrapers, etc. if they are on sale and can be viewed as disposable;
4) "dumb" stuff like hammers, punches, and non-powered tools like large wrenches and sockets, screwdrivers, vises and arbour presses are fine;
5) shop equipment such as toolboxes, storage bins etc. are usually OK - but inspect them before leaving the store as many items seem to get dinged-up in transit from whereevertheheck they are made;
6) any brand name tools like Channel-Lock pliers are fine (and at Princess Auto, these often go on sale);
7) disposable / consumable items like shop rags, masks, goggles, electrical wire and wiring connectors, etc. are also OK.
Having said that, I have a tap and die set that I bought at Canadian Tire (think Pep Boys combined with Ace Hardware and bit of Home Despot) about 50 years ago - and they are still going strong - although some common size taps (like 1/4-20 UNC and M6 and M8, etc.) have been replaced over the years because I broke them or they wore out.
Soooooo....based on all of that, I think, I'd hold out for a Dormer or other name-brand set of taps and dies - unless all you are going to do is chase-out threads etc. In that case, they may be just fine!
Pete
PS - check out the Project Farm channel on YouTube - it really is excellent. I have told the host that most of his videos would be worthy of a Masters degree in engineering - they are that well-done.
Last edited:
I have one, pretty low quality but it’ll work for chasing threads and retapping.
I needed a metric tap in a bind and the set was all I could get a hold of that day on the road.
The holders are pretty much garbage but if it’s real light duty they work.
I haven't looked at their TnD sets. For general stuff I've been relatively happy with their other drilling tools but have been bit before by ACE Hardware, Hanson Whitney, Craftsman and other TnD kits that are basically OK for rethreading or cleaning up existing threads but don't trust them much for serious stuff
I'd definitely go for a recognized brand, like Thurmer, Dormer or other, made in Germany, Sweden, Denmark, UK, US or Japan. Taiwanese or Chinese is hardly the same quality......
If you have a tap handle go to Napa or whereever get an m5 m6 m8 m10 tap and an m6 bottoming tap. Also get a metric thread chaser. Done.
Be aware that "M10" most often is regular coarse thread 10x1.50
The XS, just like all other japanese motorcycles use M10x1.25 and also M12x1.25 on most fasteners.
As a side note, Brembo 4 piston calipers with 40 mm bolt spacing have M10x1.50 thread, while the later calipers with 65 mm spacing have M10x1.25.
....true and you can buy a nice tap handle on-line (just search for Craftsman, Snap-On or any of the recognized brands of taps and dies).
If you need Imperial taps and dies, I'd suggest 1/4-20 UNC, 5/16-18 UNC, 3/8-16 UNC, 7/16-14 UNC and 1/2-13 UNC should about cover most equipment you'd run into (the fine threads aren't that common in my experience). I just checked and McMaster-Carr has decent stuff at a reasonable price.
Also- get a can of tapping lubricant (many people use WD40).
For drilling and tapping in stainless and duplex steels, I have very good experience with "Rocol" cutting oil and cutting compound (A UK brand, afaik)
I’ve also had decent luck with Irwin. At least you can buy singular and it comes with a sized bit.
I bought one of these thread chaser kits a couple years back, very nice. It also includes one of the most useful thread tools you can have for an old bike, a thread file .....
https://www.jbtools.com/kastar-2584...MIuLqmzJK9-QIVhb7ICh2obQuCEAQYAyABEgJWfvD_BwE
https://www.jbtools.com/kastar-2584...MIuLqmzJK9-QIVhb7ICh2obQuCEAQYAyABEgJWfvD_BwE
On sale right now too!
One of my first projects when I got my degree in machine tool operation (manual machining).
With all the drawing, jig, set ups etc… easy got 50+ hours into it hahaha.
Even did the heat treating.
All my American USS & SAE are Greenfield Industries. All my metric are Hanson. Greenfield was bought in 1967 and most still work fine. The Hanson`s are Ace HDW throw aways but work in a pinch especially on Sunday when I seem to brake the most stuff. Rapid Tap cutting oil only.
Although I haven’t had my hands on a HF tap and die set, I would imagine they aren’t the best quality. Maybe ok to get you out of a jam, but for regular use it would be best to get good quality tools. I have bought a couple of Icon wrench sets from HF and they seem to be a good set of tools. Their Pittsburgh line of wrenches are of much poorer construction. Again, for very occasional use they may be ok..
Up here, Canadian Tire sells a set of taps and dies under the “Maximum” branding. Not really high end stuff but good for the price. You can get the big sae / metric set on sale for about $80.
Up here, Canadian Tire sells a set of taps and dies under the “Maximum” branding. Not really high end stuff but good for the price. You can get the big sae / metric set on sale for about $80.
Keep in mind if you want to cut threads, choose HSS, not carbon steel. Carbon steel is ok for chasing threads, but not so good for cutting them. Cheap HSS taps and dies are ok, but they will blunten over time, but they are cheap to replace. You may be better off buying them individually as you need them in sets of three: Tapered, intermediate and bottoming. Dies are available split or not, stay away from non split dies, splits are adjustable so you can adjust them to get a better thread fit.
I do a hell of a lot of threading with dies, taps and on the lathe, I only buy cheapies though, they work well with Trifolex (kero for aluminium) or similar and it seems to extend their life. M6 are extremely common, I have a handful of them: Tapered, intermediate and bottoming, plus a lot of reground ones for specific jobs. Pay attention to shaft size: Some have shafts the same size as the finished thread, so if you have a long thread to cut they are useless. Pick ones with root diameter sized shafts, they break easier because they are thinner, so take it easy with them.
HSS taps and dies generally have 'HSS' stamped on them somewhere and are shiny, carbon steel taps and dies have a dull finish and are not always marked.
Oh, and be aware most metric tap sets only have course thread taps and dies, be aware, there are a lot of fine threads also on bikes. Most of the threads resident' on the XS650 frame are fine, shock mounts, foot peg mounts, etc. Stock engine mount bolts are also fine threads.
I do a hell of a lot of threading with dies, taps and on the lathe, I only buy cheapies though, they work well with Trifolex (kero for aluminium) or similar and it seems to extend their life. M6 are extremely common, I have a handful of them: Tapered, intermediate and bottoming, plus a lot of reground ones for specific jobs. Pay attention to shaft size: Some have shafts the same size as the finished thread, so if you have a long thread to cut they are useless. Pick ones with root diameter sized shafts, they break easier because they are thinner, so take it easy with them.
HSS taps and dies generally have 'HSS' stamped on them somewhere and are shiny, carbon steel taps and dies have a dull finish and are not always marked.
Oh, and be aware most metric tap sets only have course thread taps and dies, be aware, there are a lot of fine threads also on bikes. Most of the threads resident' on the XS650 frame are fine, shock mounts, foot peg mounts, etc. Stock engine mount bolts are also fine threads.
Attachments
Last edited:
When I was stationed in Malaysia, 93-95,there was a small alley on Penang Island we all called 'Tool Alley'. only half a dozen stalls/shops, but there was no no tool you couldn't buy there. I haunted the place buying up lots of tools: Micrometers, calipers, end mills, drills, chucks, spanners, a chop saw, boxes of chop saw blades, scissors, hammers, taps and dies and so on.
Chinese tools weren't a big thing back then, you could still buy them though along with tools made in Taiwan, India, Britain, US as well as locally made tools: cheap, cheap, cheap. I bought dozens and dozens of taps and dies: course threads, fine threads, I still have them, minus a few smaller taps, 3-6mm, which broke. Interestingly, the brand name taps I bough back in Oz t to replace the smaller broken ones, were no better. They still broke, still went blunt.
With the exception of the chop saw, I still have all those tools and they get a hiding everyday. Now days I just buy cheap Chinese tools, I've never had a problem with them, except for a dial calliper I bought recently (dial came loose). I even tested the cheap micrometers against a Mitutoyo I have, measures exactly the same.
Tools were amazingly cheap in Malaysia, I bought a mill machine for around $Aus400. No longer have that though, sold it as it wasn't getting any use. Kicking myself ever since: No such thing as too many tools..
Chinese tools weren't a big thing back then, you could still buy them though along with tools made in Taiwan, India, Britain, US as well as locally made tools: cheap, cheap, cheap. I bought dozens and dozens of taps and dies: course threads, fine threads, I still have them, minus a few smaller taps, 3-6mm, which broke. Interestingly, the brand name taps I bough back in Oz t to replace the smaller broken ones, were no better. They still broke, still went blunt.
With the exception of the chop saw, I still have all those tools and they get a hiding everyday. Now days I just buy cheap Chinese tools, I've never had a problem with them, except for a dial calliper I bought recently (dial came loose). I even tested the cheap micrometers against a Mitutoyo I have, measures exactly the same.
Tools were amazingly cheap in Malaysia, I bought a mill machine for around $Aus400. No longer have that though, sold it as it wasn't getting any use. Kicking myself ever since: No such thing as too many tools..
When you get pissed off, I have an old tap and die set, mostly metric. Come over and grab what you need. I have used them mostly for chasing threads.
